Popsit & Sweets

Hi, Everyone is invited to a Trash Out day at Lake Rotoma .. 10.30am Sat 26th April 2003. Seeherefor details.. Popsit and Sweets

My twopence worth... For me (and popsit) the attraction is not being too sure where you are going and actually having to hunt for something that is hidden. Reminds me of treasure hunts when I was a kid, something magic in that for us.. Virtual caches just dont do it for me.. The placing of a cache indicates that someone took some time and trouble and personal expense. Knowing that gives the cache value to me.. I know the lookout Navigull refers to well..on the top of the saddle between Kuritau and Taumarunui..It deserved to be listed as a place of interest but to me it is not a 'geocache' location. The DOC approval issue in respect of that location is a non starter.. It is a tourist rest stop, toilet area, sealed roadway, structure location,come rubbish dump.. The hiding of a cache just doesnt compare to the environmental impact occuring there!! Not even the most extreme greenie could argue a case for banning a cache from that location!! All argument about damage and 'environmental care' issues are based on the presence of the people not the cache so how is a virtual cache solving this? At no time have I seen any posting by DOC indicating that the placing of caches should cease in respect of areas like this..vague claims of illegality have no foundation and when pressed on this issue DOC have backed away completely. I am not sure that virtual caches add any value at all to geocaching and maybe they should have their own section? Just my thoughts for the night.. Be well all...and welcome to Geocaching Navigull.. Russell ORR

Well there it is.. I should know that nothing is 'off the record' but no harm done. I suggest that as we now have DOC asking for liason we should oblige. As I have said before I am happy to talk to Gareth and without entering into any MOU or formal agreements I can find out what the issues are going to be. Then I can bring them back to this forum for discussion and suggestions. This should not stop continuing discussion and sounding out of support toward forming an INC Society. I propose to give this message a week to air and if there are no dissentions or alternative person coming forward (maybe someone in Wellington?) I will speak personally with Gareth and see whats what..

Me to (On behalf of Popsit who hates long steep hills)

Count me in.. sweets

double speak? Oh you mean the official language of Govmint bureaucracy? Its how you have to talk to anyone in the Govmint if you want to get you message accross these days.. I will translate for the Bureaucratically impaired... "The bro's gotta rap wi da Man!"

Thanks Clive and Neil for those previous threads. They cover the issue pretty well. I was stationed at Opotiki for a few years in the early 90's and formed an excellent relationship with the DOC o/c there who is still there. (Kevin Cannell) I have just got off the phone to him after an 'off the record' discussion on geocaching.. Result.. He hasnt actually heard of it before and is sure that DOC have no official policy. His personal view (he speaks for the East Coast Conservatory) is that DOC would like an approach from someone with a representative mandate (however that might be achieved) to commence discussions in order to work towards a MOU. (memorandum of understanding). I also suggest that similar MOU should be considered with TLA inc Regional Councils and significant landowners ( eg Forestry) who permit limited recreational use of lands thay might own or control). These MOU to be formulated together so that some standardisation be obtained with perhaps some local variations if neccessary. Doc have a policy of encouraging responsible recreactional use of their estate in keeping with the Conservation ethos. Restrictions within an MOU are likely to be basic commonsense ones allready covered by geocaching.com.and covering items that can be cached as well as some locations where caching would not be permitted such as areas considered dangerous or where existing restrictions apply (ie islands where wildlife is being re-established etc). Sounds like an overkill? Maybe it is. There is certainly nothing to stop what we are doing now and DOC are not going to bother us. The advantage of a MOU, even a simple one, is that Geocachers become stakeholders in our public recreational areas with the consultation and flow on publicity which that provides. There is a channel formed so that doc workers know who to contact should they be planning work in a spot where a cache is located or come across one. This applies to applies probably more so to local councils. The next step is probably to form an association or simply a geocaching club with voluntary membership in order to further the interests of all NZ Geocachers by the formulation and negotiation of MOU, organising events, competions and gatherings, seeking publicity oportunities and generally enhanching the sport in NZ. What needs to happen next is robust discusssion and a rough gauge of support for the concept followed by a meeting at some convenient waypoint to thrash out a constitution, elect some office holders, and start the process.. Right now is the time to put forward ideas and comments. Maybe it is too soon for a formal organisation? What role does Geocaching.com have in this? What say you all?

Ah Bureaucracy .. permits, regulations etc .. the comforter of the weak willed.. Here is NZ we are mostly still free spirited and self confident have little need of that sort of nonsense.. Still it doesnt hurt to make friends of persons and depts that can cause you aggravation.. On that note I suggest that someone make contact with DOC and act as a liason.. They will love that approach as demonstrating a responsible attitude and it might prevent 'misunderstandings' Doc will almost certainly have a few rules mostly commonsense but it will make someone feel important. I will volunteer if there is a consensus on this or there may be someone else with better contacts?? While On the subject of the rules of geocaching etc. I heard recently a story of a geocacher who trespassed onto a local famers property. Farmer said he couldnt go through but the Geocacher claimed a right pursuant to the "Queens Chain". Farmer disagreed and suggested a way to settle the issue .. an old fashioned kicking contest. He explained that they each kicked the other until someone gave up.Geocacher agreed. The farmer steped back and delivered the geocacher such a kick to the goolies that the cruch could be heard for miles. The Geocacher eventually stopped screaming and writhing on the ground, got back to his feet, eyed the farmer and anounced that it was his turn. Farmer said, "Nah I give up, you can can go through if you want", and walked off.

Hobbiton is on the backroad from Matamata to Karapiro.. Was past that way the other day and called in.. The site is well off the road but the landowner was running a bus to it. Business was booming. (Didnt have my GPS then) He might see the benefits of having a cache somewhere there!

quote:. Lets hope the removal of the flare doesn't put anyone at risk in the future . Only Jeremy .. that lollipo's still there...

It is now safe to approach Dopers den. I took the flare out last night.. As a matter of interest they are smoke type handheld flares.. I always carry them when going bush.. good things to pop when you hear the chopper..Far cheaper option for most people than an EPLB ...Considering the armament regularly carried in the US and left in cars, purses, desks etc they have a cheek.... However I still urge caution... the peanut bar is still there and may cause choking.. the cdrom may cause serious injury if the edge is rubbed furiously against the skin ... The pencil in with the log book could also be a hazard to eyes and the lollipop will be very painful if rammed up an orifice...

These maps were not commercially scanned .. this is raw (raster?)data from LINZ hence my problems stitching it... I have sent you an offline email on this subject.. In any event it is not illegally obtained or copyright and is probably useful to geocachers so I have put a copy in my first cache which went in today.. I have sent off the report and it will go on site as soon as it is approved I guess..

Oops .. A bit off on the scaling and file size in my previous post. The sid files are actually 1:190 scale scans and each file (260 map) decompresses to approx 1Gb.. Now you understand my problem?

Hmm... Thanks for the Photoshop stitch sequence Nick I will have a little play with that in a minute but I'm not holding my breath. I cannot open 4 .sid maps on my PC at once.. takes gegs of ram to do that!!(Cant even open one) I will try taking a piece at a time which is all I have ever been able to do.. Must get more ram Will let you know howe I get on.. I had a look at Tumonz... Interesting but I suspect it cant provide the detail I am looking for. I couldnt find any screen shots but I note that they polygon the contours instead of drawing them so right away i lost interest.. The entire NZ set fits on a 650mb disk??? It is obvious that they recreate the map from data as required rather than a 1:19,000 scan as my .sid maps are.. If I convert one 260 series map from .sid to .jpg it blows up to 144mb.. I dare not try and decompress it further.. my PC throws a hissy fit..I have 30 maps just to do the BOP!! All I can really do is take out pieces.. But if anyone is interested in a 30 map 260 series BOP set at 1:19K in MrSID with .tab and.sdw'slet me know.. I can burn off a copy as LINZ have no copyright on them anymore..

Has anyone any experience with this stuff? I have a BOP series that I am getting to grips with.. The viewer for this format is a free download from the MrSID site but the printing is lousy. I have found a pluin for Photoshop that gives much improved printing but I am struggling.. What I really need is a way to stich the individual 260 series maps for situations when the area of interest falls in a corner.. The viewer has accurate NZGD1949 grid. Currently the process is.. 1. Convert WGS84 lat/long to NZGD49. To do this I use the converter on the LINZ website. However it doesnt do decimal minutes only dec secs or Dec degrees so I have to multiply out the dec minutes to find the seconds value. Another way is to eneter the WGS84 waypoint into the etrex then change units to NZGD and read the waypoint back in NZGD. 2. Locate the waypoint on the 260 series using the NZGD co-ordinates (or if I have no idea which map it might be on .. converting thru to a 260 series co ordinate which is only map no and 8 digit total co ordinate which isnt acurate enough but at least gives the map number) The viewer gives a good position indicator but doesnt allow the image to be marked so any print or cut and paste looses the mark! Apart from the need to stitch the 260 series maps the images are excellent and as good as printed topos with better zoom. Any comments ideas suggestions..

Big Nick wanted to know if anyone has joined re that article... Well that would be me (us).. Its taken a bit of getting organised (getting a GPS, learning to use it, learning to convert co-ordinates, getting some mapdata together, studying the website) but well worth while. I used to just stomp thru the bush for the fun of it but now there's a purpose and that makes it much more fun. I have some serious country east of me and would be curious to know what calibre of geocacher we have? If I put a cache in the Ureweras or Raukumaras (say a days tramp in and another day back) would anyone bother to look for it? I guess the only thing I can do is bung it in and find out. A little questionaire on the route should eliminate helicopters based geocachers