yogazoo

And we have our answer. The updated Montana's will retain the resistive touchscreen. As its primarily for motorcyclists and hunters, both demo's known to wear thick leather or insulated gloves, the call to retain the resistive screen was a good one IMHO. See this post from a hands-on: https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&nv=1&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http://gpsradler.de/news/garmin-stellt-montana-610-680-und-680t-vor/%3Fpk_campaign%3Dfeed%26pk_kwd%3Dgarmin-stellt-montana-610-680-und-680t-vor%26utm_source%3Dtwitterfeed%26utm_medium%3Dtwitter&usg=ALkJrhihOUAkwr-sPdwkQqoOqJLFgO5WHA

The Montana line has always used the Li-ion battery. They will accept NIMH as well. Best of both worlds. GPSCity has the Montana 680/610 in-stock September 30th. In plenty of time for rifle season in Montana.

As far as hardware goes the addition of GLONASS would require a new, possibly snappier, chipset. Although I never had a problem with the older Montana's being slow at all. Aside from the chipset and "updated" screen (whatever that is) you're right. Another difference of note is that the updated Montana's come with a 1yr BirdsEye Imagery subscription. At least some would have purchased a subscription anyway so, for those folks, the MSRP is $10 cheaper!

It also looks like there will be at least a few interface updates as well. It's great to see the "Current Track" app make an appearance on one of the images from the product page. This was a great addition to the Oregon 6xx and will be awesome on the new Montana's.

The words that tip me off to the probability of a capacitive touchscreen are "updated" and "glove friendly". It's unlikely that they "updated" the screen with another resistive screen. Resistive touchscreen technology just isn't used anymore in most consumer applications. I didn't mind the older resistive, and it worked quite well, but if Garmin "updated" the screen it's very likely that they put in a capacitive. On top of that, the "glove friendly" term has been used to describe the newer generation of highly sensitive capacitive screens. This is all assumption based on a few verbal clues of course. It's possible I'm reading too much into it. We will soon know for sure. Resistive was fine but capacitive is a bit more durable. I sold my Montana to buy the Oregon 6xx when it came out. I love the Oregon 650 but I missed the larger screen real estate on the Montana. Being a serious map obsessive, that large screen just gave me more to admire at a glance.

The Montana line has been a big seller among the hunting crowd. Plenty of hunters in many areas are ATV and off-road vehicle users so the dual purpose functionality (auto cradle to handheld in a split second) is attractive. Garmin likes to lazer focus on market niches and Bluetooth would be lost on many hunters of which I'm one. Give them that huge screen and the ability to use it on the ATV and on the trail and they're happy. I don't think the non-flat faced design is anything to be disappointed about. It appears to have the updated capacitive screen. I can't remember having issues with input on the old resistive screen with the same form factor. But, we'll see if the capacitive is any different.

See Announcement at this link: http://garmin.blogs.com/my_weblog/2015/08/introducing-the-montana-610-610t-camo-680-and-680t.html#.Vdz5AcvnbqA Added GLONASS, 8MP camera (680), updated touchscreen, and a years subscription to BirdsEye Imagery are among the updates.

The user interface tweaks look compelling. I really like the ability to select activities like on my Fenix 3. However, the same could be done on my Oregon 6xx by customizing profiles. I also use the BlueTooth LiveTrack feature on my 64s for work. Great feature and I'm glad to see it make the new eTrex! Eagerly awaiting first impressions.

ZeMartelo, look for the "Added ability to cook you omelettes" in version 4.70 Sheesh

Changes made from version 4.40 to 4.60: Improved 'Save Portion' track feature. When saving a portion, the device now remembers that position in the track log so it can be used as a track segment for future portion saving. Fixed possible erroneous track point on power on. Fixed output of SNR in $GPGSV NMEA sentence. Pretty sweet fix in this update! It fixes the following issue among others: 1. Turn on track log, log a few points at your current position 2. Turn off your device 3. Move a to a new location 4. Turn on your device 5. Track log drops a point at your previous position with the current time 6. Track log drops a point 1 second later at your current position with the current time 7. This results in your track log saying you went from the previous position to the current position in 1 second at 800 miles per hour or something equally as ludicrous. Given the fact that this issue was just fixed on the 64 I would expect that a similar update for most Garmin models to be forthcoming.

Changes made from version 3.90 to 4.00: Improved 'Save Portion' track feature. When saving a portion, the device now remembers that position in the track log so it can be used as a track segment for future portion saving. Fixed possible erroneous track point on power on. Fixed formatting issue with certain map names in the map information list. Fixed output of SNR in $GPGSV NMEA sentence. This version fixes the following issue among others: 1. Turn on track log, log a few points at your current position 2. Turn off your device 3. Move a to a new location 4. Turn on your device 5. Track log drops a point at your previous position with the current time 6. Track log drops a point 1 second later at your current position with the current time 7. This results in your track log saying you went from the previous position to the current position in 1 second at 800 miles per hour or something equally as ludicrous.

And Bluetooth support for Garmin Connect similar to the 64 series. Garmin Connect compatibility for Live Tracking is a feature the Oregon 6xx series lacks. I'm really looking forward to this model. Especially with the smaller form factor and longer battery life inherent of the eTrex series. Also, what SUSSAMB said, the firmware would likely be stable from the start having had it's framework formed from previous models (not built from scratch).

eTrex Touch Announcement

Let me know how the geocaching goes atnbirdie. I'm assuming your loading them as simple "location" points. I was brand new to the Garmin smart watch world and it was a bit of a learning curve but not too bad. What originally threw me for a loop I now consider as a rather nice setup. I'm really growing to like the Epix more and more and wear it as my primary watch for every-day. I would still love to know my EPE data though. It's not perfect but we're only on firmware v2.20.

Sgt_Strider, My impressions on the Epix weren't mean't to be a downer unless of course you wanted the Epix for geocaching. The Epix and Fenix 3 are in all regards the same firmware with the exception of the mapping and street routing on the Epix. You won't get anything on the Fenix that the Epix doesn't have. The mapping is an addition worthy of the the extra $50 in my opinion. And again, the impressions were mostly my opinions and I may be incorrect with some of the functions as I'm still learning how this thing works. I'll update this thread when new firmware is released if new functionality is added or changed. We'll see where we are in a few firmware updates.

Sorry to hear PC12. It sounds like an axis on your electronic compass may have either become magnetized or suffered vibration damage. Magnetization can be eliminated through a degaussing process but unfortunately it will erase the units flash memory as well. Vibration damage is mechanical and might be undone through further vibration or made worse. If I were you I would keep my eyes peeled for a cosmetically damaged unit on an auction site (cracked screen maybe) and attempt to swap out internals. That, of course, depends on your comfort level with that sort of thing. Not sure what else you can do. Good luck

Well, I finally had some time to spend using my Epix. First note, for those here who geocache (probably everyone) there is no current ability to do paperless geocaching. There is actually no geocaching ability at all other than loading them as waypoints and even then all you see are the codes. I'm sure some here could manipulate a PQ with one of the many programs out there to at least have those waypoints listed by name and not code. Whether Garmin includes geocaching as a feature remains to be seen. My brief first impressions in a few areas: Look and feel - The watch is surprisingly light for one that looks like a tank. I previously wore an all metal Seiko that weighed a ton and may affect my opinion. The watch is light-weight and appears to be well constructed and rugged. Metal trim on the front with darkened metal buttons. The size of the Epix on my largish wrist is just fine and suitable to me for daily wear. Those with small wrists might have a different opinion. I've banged the watch up a bit and have a small rub mark on the plastic watch case but no scratches on the metal yet despite bouncing it off of plenty of surfaces. And don't worry, when I say "plastic" I mean a very tough engineered type. The screen feels like mineral glass but I would highly recommend investing the few bucks for a screen protector. I purchase large sheets of screen protector material designed for old, out-of-date laptops and tablets. Retailers have fire sales of the stuff that's cut to fit old stock and with a sharp scissors or razor you can cut your own to fit anything. Screen - The screen is beautifully reflective and really looks great in bright to moderate light. However, the screen can be a challenge to see indoors or in low ambient lighting. Luckily of course there is a backlight that activates by pressing a dedicated button. The backlight itself is nothing special and makes the screen look a bit washed out. Also, the backlight has bright and dim spots but nothing too noticeable. Perfectly fine screen and backlight implementation. Interface - There are 5 buttons (3 onthe left and 2 on the right) along with the touchscreen. I find the touchscreen interface a bit cumbersome for menu items at the moment just due to the limited input space. It is a smaller screen and it doesn't help that I have large fingers. I mostly use the buttons for everything which is fine since the interface setup doesn't require screen touch input whatsoever. It can all be done with the buttons. The Epix is quite snappy while navigating menu items and changing screens (widgets). Operation - Having never owned a Fenix, or any Garmin fitness watch for that matter, I had to read the online manual to even get started. Coming from the Garmin handheld world the Epix really threw me. The setup and menu items are so different that I'm still trying to figure it all out. Like anything new there will be a learning curve to operate this watch effectively. It's not bad, just different. For example, the GPS is not always on and there is no "switch" in the setup to just turn it on. You have to be on a widget or in an activity app which automatically turns the GPS on and subsequently off upon exit. Another change is that when you start an activity app you are dedicated to the settings in that app and can't access the main widget area without exiting the activity you're engaged in. So it just takes a bit of time to set up each activity app to how you like it (data fields, map, routing options, etc). It makes sense (intuitive) and will just take some time for me to become comfortable with it. Connect IQ - In my opinion many of the Connect IQ apps currently available are unpolished for implementation on the Epix. Granted, this whole concept is basically brand new so it's understandable. Some apps that were designed for the Vivoactive (released last fall) were modified for the Epix but can be a little quirky. I can't tell if it's the apps or the Epix firmware that needs a bit of work but the Epix is brand new to the larger market and I'm sure things will get ironed out in the near future. Some apps and widgets work well and are nice additions. The "data fields" section kind of baffles me a bit. In that I mean I can't understand why some of those data fields aren't just included in the watch firmware. For example, the battery life icon that you can enable in handhelds as a data field must be downloaded from the connect IQ store for use on the Epix. The watch faces are ok but, in my opinion, there is a lot of junk in the Connect IQ "watch face" store. Although there are a few other good options, the default watch face is the only customizable face and, in my opinion, is the best from a visibility and data standpoint. Others needs may influence their choice of watch face. Map - As stated above, the screen on the Epix is a beauty in good light. And viewing the maps is a more pleasant experience and way more useable than I had envisioned. I have Garmin 24k topo, a plethora of third party maps, and BirdsEye all loaded up. 8GB is plenty for vector based maps but you'll find it fills up quickly when adding BirdsEye image tiles. I have found that the use of transparent maps or overlay maps will crash the system so I removed my hunting district overlay maps until Garmin issues a fix. There is no night mode (disappointing) and there is currently no way to enable terrain shading. Again, perhaps in a future update. BirdsEye is ok but appears to be compressed a bit when added to or viewed on the Epix. Birdseye pixelation/grainyness is noticeable at closer zoom levels and the amount of detail I'm used to on my Oregon simply isn't there on "highest" resolution images. BirdsEye is however usable and the Epix comes with a free one year subscription. I have one little gripe about the map screen aside from the aforementioned; I have the Garmin 24k topo's loaded and when I select a point on the map and review that points data I can see the distance to point, coordinates, township-range-section, and USGS quad name but the Epix doesn't query the elevation data that is built in to the Garmin 24k and 100k topo maps. This functionality would be great if you want to calibrate the altimeter and don't have access to any other source of accurate elevation data other than from the GPS. Overall my impressions are largely positive. I know some here will be shocked to hear me say that the Epix feels unpolished on the firmware front. Things like some data fields crossing over into the neighboring field, map lags, some system crashes have been observed. For a fitness watch it's pretty amazing but for a GPS I still prefer my Oregon 650 or 64 for the comfort factor since I'm simply accustomed to using them. A comment was made in a post on another forum that currently the functionality of the Epix feels just like a Fenix 3 with a map screen. I would have to agree with that statement and look forward to the Epix maturing into an outdoors centric hiking and geocaching watch first and a fitness watch second. One drawback of the Epix from a GPS standpoint is that there is no way to gauge GPS accuracy. No, there is no satellite screen to see your status and there is no EPE data field you can enable. I've heard rumors that Garmin does not intend to implement any way to determine your GPS accuracy which, in my view is unfortunate. I'll be testing the GPS accuracy against my Oregon and 64 through tracklog comparison in the coming days when I find a chunk of time to do it right.

First impressions of the Epix in German. Just use a browser based translator if you speak English. http://www.naviboard.de/vb/showthread.php?t=58510 Apparently the user is not able to load some newer third party maps(OSM). That fact is troubling and I hope that it's a firmware glitch and not Garmin's new direction. I'll investigate/verify this when I receive my unit on Friday. I'm sure Garmin knows that third party map compatibility has been a strong driver of unit sales over the past 7 or so years. Ending third party map compatibility to increase Garmin map sales would be cutting off their nose to spite their face. Maybe it's an old firmware glitch that was ported from the troublesome set of releases to handheld units late last year. During that time Garmin changed the map verification mechanism in their firmware code and inadvertently blocked some third party maps. Time will tell.

Get this. I noticed that the Epix availability on the REI website said "In Stock" so I called them today to ask them about it. Indeed, REI shipped the Epix to stores and that I could cancel my pre-order and make a new order to have my unit arrive this Friday. The one I'll be getting was sitting on a shelf at a brick-n-morter. I asked them why their pre-orders weren't filled first to which there was no real answer. Just another layer added to what has been a bit of a saga since day 1. My unit will arrive this Friday and hopefully I'll be able to post some first impressions and screenshots of Geocaching displays.

And to speak of the issues on the 6xx wiki. Most of those issues are geocaching related. Not all but most. With all the manipulations of geocaching GPX/GGZ files and all the data they contain by various third parties and softwares I'm amazed that there are not more issues. I might load a pocket query straight from Groundspeak once a year that contains 200-500 caches on it and have had nothing notable issue-wise for quite some time. If you're hardcore, mashing, splitting, combining geocache files you may experience more issues. My uses are primarily for navigation and data logging and the Oregon 6xx excels at the tasks I ask of it. Bottom line, your experience can vary based on your uses.

Hmm... The GPS unit I'm using has 27 times as many pixels as this new Garmin (a bit over 2 million). But then, it's a phone. And the display, with a good map and some cache icons sprinkled here and there, is a thing of beauty. You're probably comparing apples to oranges here. Pixel count cannot be directly compared unless the screens are the same size. You need to calculate the pixels per inch to have a direct comparison. Even still, your smartphone likely has more pixels even after converting to pixels per inch (or centimeters if you don't live in the U.S.) Density and screen size are only half the equation when it comes to screen quality in an outdoor device designed to maximize battery life (minimize backlight use/intensity) and readability (pixel reflectivity). Increased pixel density reduces the reflective surface below the pixel making it less reflective and harder to see without a very bright backlight in many ambient lighting conditions. Garmin has done very well in finding the sweet spot between resolution and readability in their devices.

You're right about screen resolutions effect on battery life. I'm hoping/guessing the increased drain from the resolution will be compensated by updated component efficiencies elsewhere. My biggest concern regarding the screen will be the reflectivity of the smaller pixels. Along with increased pixel density usually comes reduced readability in direct and indirect sunlight. Again, this might be compensated with technological advancements in LCD screens making smaller pixels more reflective/readable in various lighting situations. I'm excited to see the new eTrex line.

There is already a 20x/30x WebUpdater firmware release available for download. It's version 2.00. Last version I loaded onto my 20 was 4.20. Not to mean it will use the same firmware as the soon-to-be older models. Rather quite likely most of the same code plus some additions and/or changes hence Garmin will restart the version numbers associated with the "x" models. It will be interesting, provided I choose to early-adopt, to compare track logs and data with not only the previous model but other handhelds as well.

Coming from the older 20 & 30 models, the unit firmware should be turn-key without many of the bugs associated with new releases. One of the reasons for the smooth-ish 64 release was that it was built off of the 62 software.

I'm positive the new eTrex models will come with a faster processor. Slow map draws were among the biggest complaints of the previous model which came with a first generation, slow, glonass/GPS, processor. Garmin normally doesn't list processor types in spec sheets but you can bet they've upgraded processors.