skydiver

99.9% figuring out where to go, figuring out how to get there, and then actually getting myself there. 0.1% everything else. So, I voted don't mind. --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------

You can definately tell how much fun I had on the cache hunt by the length of my log entries, and mine range from 'baged it, taged it' to several paragraphs describing an amazing adventure, complete with pictures. But then agan, I would never go hunt 24 caches in one day either. I'd much rather spend that time hunting one interesting cache that takes all day to get to, than hunt 24 caches that leave me feeling cheap and sleezy at the end of the day. --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------

Thanks. Managed to go nab my first WA cache, Elda's Paradise over my layover. --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------

Just found out I'll be at the Seattle Airport this afternoon with almost a three hour layover. What caches are nearby that I could hit quick? Need to post links here in the next couple hours for it to do me any good. After that, this thread is dead. Actually, is there any chance any of you are so bored today that you wanna pick me up at the airport and drive me around to the nearby caches? --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------

I voted leave it. Nobody has been given any guarantee to be able to find every cache. Some caches are physically challenging, others mentally challenging, and some are easy. The are no upper limits to how much effort reaching a simple logbook should take, other than those limits we each impose on ourselves. If the cache surpasses your own personal limits, then don't go for that cache, plain and simple ... and don't whine and moan about it either. --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------

So, yesterday I recieved all three that were scheduled before 1:00 AM. Usually, I get the first before 1:00 AM, and the rest stroll in sometime before 6:00 AM (except on the days that I have four scheduled, in which case the fourth wanders in sometime in the late afternoon). Today, it's now 8:30 AM in my time zone, and the first has yet to show up. Rarely when it goes this long before receiving the first do I get anything at all, so my hopes aren't high for today. --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------

Yup, go for it. You won't get as many finders as the effortless caches do, but some of us actually like to work for it. --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------

Ok, as long as we're being nit-picky, here's a couple things that have been mildly bugging me for a while ... but I only bring them up now because, well, they've only been mildly bugging me, and frankly, I really don't give a $#!^. 1. On the email a user page, it says ... "For your security, your email address will not be sent along with this message (just your username).", however, the "I want to send my email address along with this message" checkbox is checked by default everytime, and if I don't want to send my email address I need to uncheck it, ... so, make up your mind, which is it? 2. Well, I was going to say something about the map page still saying something about an update in February ... but now the map page only gives me, "Could't load the shapefile: C:inetpubshapefilescachedataoldcaches.shp", so I think that might be an actual problem, as opposed to nit-picky whining. So, fix 'em , don't fix 'em, I don't care. Either way I'm on my second year of paid membership, and looking forward to my third. Keep up the great work. --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------

quote:How immediate an area does it have to be to fall into the _what the heck_ category. Oh yah, also happened to have the GPS for the first one. --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------

quote:Originally posted by yumitori:What about an interesting hiding place? Here's a quote from a log entry for a micro hidden in an uninteresting spot - "SCHWEEEEEEET!!! The coordinates were right on, and The Force agreed (mostly) , but I still had trouble finding it. This is probably the best urban microcache container ever thought of." Obviously urban micros appeal to folks for various reasons. Of course, what's an interesting hide for one person might not be for the next. Perhaps we can let everyone decide for themselves what's worthwhile. Strange how you would bring up my own post for what at the time (almost a year ago), was the very first micro cache in this area, and was therefore very clever and unique. I stand by my words, for when I found that cache, it WAS a unique and clever hide in a unique and clever location. Unfortunately, that particular fun idea has been beaten into the ground by those that think every piece of metal to stick a magnet to qualifies as 'unique' and 'clever' all over again. quote:I really see no reason to worry about the motivations of anyone except myself. But since you brought it up, it does raise the question of why you bother to log such caches then... In the last month I've hunted two. One purely because a friend who'd tried for it wanted me to come help (and pretty much had to drag me there kicking and screaming, despite the fact it was less than a quarter mile from my house), and the other on the off chance there was something clever and unique about it that I couldn't tell without hunting it, and I was in the immediate area anyway, so what the heck. I'll likely log two more in the near future, both strictly because some friends who have found them are concerned that one might be considered offensive in it's placement to certain individuals, and the other potentially illegal, and are bugging me to go find them because they want my opinion on the subject. Other than that, I'd have no real reason to hunt either one, despite the fact that I walk right past one of them nearly every day. --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------

I think I need to agree with bazzle and bigeddy on this topic. I don't think the complaint is so much about micros, as it is about unremarkable hides in unremarkable places. There's just a tendancy for the unremarkable caches to be micros as well. I don't hunt caches to log another find, I hunt caches to have fun and enjoy the hunt itself (and as long as I do, I don't care if I don't find the cache). But, for that to happen, the cache needs to be either in a spot that is interesting to go to (i.e. not outside the post office or on the edge of the shopping mall parking lot), or have an entertaining hike, walk, puzzle, or some other redeeming value to justify it's existance. Caches that don't have some redeeming value are just caches planted for the sake of boosting someones numbers, and I really have to wonder about the motivations of those who honestly LIKE such unremarkable bag-n-tags. --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------

quote:Originally posted by leatherman:What kind of poll is this? _Where is the sky diving choice?_ Yah, what Leatherman said!!! --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------

quote:Originally posted by Elias: quote:Originally posted by skydiver:Yesterday, I only received one of the three pocket queries I should have, and the same two I didn't get yesterday I usually have several hours before now, but so far nothing today either. Actually, it looks like you had four queries scheduled to run but only one did. Not sure why that is. I'll watch it today and see if I can find out what's happening. Elias Yes, you're right it was four. Thanks for checking into it. Since I converted my point system over to using the GPX files, it's very dependent on those files getting sent out. When they don't go out, the system doesn't get updated, and those people that use it to compete against each other start to get antsy bug me about it. --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------

I agree with those that say there's already a mechanism in place. We had a similar situation here, but in our case, myself and another geocacher had confirmed that the cache was in great shape and had no busniess being disabled. So, with Jeremy's help, I eventually adopted it, and re-activated it. --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------

Yesterday, I only received one of the three pocket queries I should have, and the same two I didn't get yesterday I usually have several hours before now, but so far nothing today either. Why are they so inconsistent and flakey??? --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------

Here's my suggestion; quote:Have GAS, Will Cache. or maybe ... has anybody had a two word speech? quote:Got GAS? GAS = Geocaching Adiction Syndrome --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------

Should probably swing by this one briefly, just to see if you can help anyone out. This one is nice, if it's not too much of a drive out of your way. Short hike from the trailhead. And this one is a very nice, but not too long or difficult hike. --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------

quote:Originally posted by Jamethiel:And in the school I went to, if I had a question about how to solve a problem in my homework, my teacher always told me that If I wasn't smart enough to solve it, well too bad because they weren't gonna tell me how to do the work. Of course not! Haven't we gotten past the difference between the cache placer having the option to give clues vs. every body else who found it? Nobody's saying that the cache placer shouldn't be allowed to give clues. Move on. quote:Caches aren't a test. They are a Game. I choose to play the game. And if you bring somehthing I don't know in the game, I will attempt to teach myself. If that doesn't work, I'll ask for help. That's how I play this game. Yup, and I've never heard of a game that every player is entitled to win, reglardless of their personal performance. Even games where you play against yourself, like solitare, aren't any fun if you always win. What's the point then? -Jennifer --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------

quote:Originally posted by Jamethiel:If you are gonna add the disclaimer... why not mention that anyone rumored to be working on puzzles while not alone will have their logs deleted as they may have had help solving the puzzle. *smile* I guess Dean and I are gonna lose a few logs since we work on puzzles together. Except for the logic circuit one, which I was out of town and couldn't be there while he solved it. Why not let folks solve the puzzles using all the resources available to them. And, yes, I'd even consider the placer a resource. With enough beer and pizza, lots of folks can become resources to draw from. If I've worked 7 hours on a cache puzzle, and someone says "you are going about it wrong, think about X, not Y" and that leads me to the solution, YAY! On the other hand, if you feel that this is a competitive game instead of cooperative game, play it as you wish. I kinda like the folks I've met through geocaching and most of them aren't too strict about what constitutes help. Of course, I do routinely ask if my minivan can make it to a trailhead, and that may constitute cheating, as part of the fun should be figuring out the road conditions on your own. -Jennifer Couples working together is a whole different can of worms that I'm not going to get into, other than simply saying that I have no problem with how you and Dean work together since you log all yur finds under one joint account. Beyond that, it's a a subject for an entirely different thread (and one that I'm sure has been discussed at length somewhere here already). But back to the subject at hand. The difficulty of the cache hunt should be EXACTLY THE SAME for the 1000th finder as it was for the 1st finder. And the only way that can happen is that the first 999 people who found the cache smirk, wink, giggle, and promptly change the subject when asked for hints. Yes, the cache placer can be a source of clues, and it's up to the placer to decide what clues they are willing to give. But the other 999 finders should be left out and know to keep their trap shut. --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------

quote:Originally posted by leatherman:This subject is clearly about forcing others to play the game their way. Who's forcing who to do what? If a particular puzzle cache isn't your type of cache, then don't hunt it. It's really just as simple as that. Nobody's forcing anybody to do anything they don't want to do. And I don't know when/where YOU went to school, but when I went, cheating on homework/tests/papers/etc resulted in much more than getting yelled at by the teacher. I can't even imagine a school system where students giving each other answers is approved of. --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------

quote:Originally posted by Jamethiel:The spirit I place caches in is for the fun. If folks tell me they didn't have fun, then I may have not done enough work on my cache. Or, you may be trying to please too many people. quote:If I have to hold someone's hand through several steps in order to make them able to find my cache, I will. And I have. I've got no problem with that. Your cache, your prerogative. quote:Caches are ment to be findable. But not by everyone, or as I said, they'd all be 1/1's. quote:The harder the puzzle, the more work you may need to put into finding it. If I placed a puzzle cache you couldn't solve, would it drive you nuts? MOst certainly! And THAT where the fun is! quote:If after 3 weeks, would you write me for a hint? Heck no! That would spoil the fun! quote:Or would you let it just sit there, staring at you every time you logged on? Yup. I may be addicted to geocaching, but I'm not so obsessive that I need to find every cache. I'd hunt until I stopped having fun, and then give up and post a no find. Maybe I'd try again sometime in the future ... or maybe not. But either way, I'd feel satisfied that I did my best and had fun trying. quote:I wouldn't move a cache container. You should know better than that. But I would help someone who was unable to solve the puzzle to find part of the coordinates for that container. But there's no difference. Both actions adjust the intended difficuly of the hunt. If you freely adjust the difficulty in one respect, why not another? quote:We should agree to disagree, cause we aren't gonna agree. -Jennifer Which is why it's sad I feel I need to add the following disclaimer to all the my cache pages. Self Evident Disclaimer: The creator/owner of this cache retains full rights to relocate the container when appropriate, and decide when, and to whom, clues may, or may not, be given out regarding it's location, solution, or method in which it was hidden or camouflaged. Those who have found the cache, or even begun working on the cache hunt, should make every effort to refrain from giving away information about the hunt (even inadvertently) to those who have not reached the same stage, and should rehide the container in the same location and method in which is was found. All requests for hints should be directed to the cache owner. This disclaimer SHOULD go without saying for ALL caches, and it's presence here is merely for the benefit of those who insist it be in writing. --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------

quote:Originally posted by Jamethiel:Geocaching should be fun. If puzzles are so hard that folks get annoyed enough to stop looking, and start saying negative things about the hider due to thir frustration, that isn't "having fun". If someone is so obsesive with geocaching that an inablility to solve a puzzle cache requires them to say negative things about the hider .. then that's their personal problem, not mine or anyone elses. quote:Some owners aren't into hints at all and believe that if you can't figure it out on your own, you shouldn't be EVER able to find that cache. I believe that is wrong. Why? I don't recall when I signed up for geocaching getting a written guarantee that I'd be able to find every cache I attempted. Nobody has a god given right to find every cache. If they did, they'd all be 1/1's. quote:If I give a single hint to someone and they later are able to solve the puzzle, that's great! They still have to solve it and still have to learn whatever the puzzle is trying to teach. But shouldn't the decision of what's a 'single hint' vs. a dead giveaway be up to the cache owner? I don't understand the concept that once one has found a cache, they earn the right to distribute whatever information they want about it. quote:I learned alot from Skydiver's Scarabaeus. It was intensely satisfying to solve the puzzle. Awsome. Glad to hear it. quote:And I do know someone who is stuck on that cache and has given up due to being annoyed that it requires you to "think like Skydiver". Oh well. Maybe they'll go hide a cache that requires me to think like them. I honestly look forward to the challenge. quote:So, IMHO, give small,leading hints unless the owner says on his page that hint requests should be referred to him! So it's OK for me to move your caches to a location that I think is more appropriate, and post the new coordinates sice you didn't mention on the cache page that I shouldn't do that? Don't say that's not the same. Giving away hints to a hard puzzle, and moving a cache container are identical. Both compeltely disrespect the spirit in which the cache was placed. --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------

Excellent question. Here's my experience on the subject. I have a cache that I hid that involves a rather complex puzzle to figure out the cache location. It literally took me several months to put everything together and make it all work. I gave the cache a 5 start difficulty rating, which I felt was adequate warning that this was a difficult hunt for those that may not be interested in such a challange. Since then, I've had one finder threaten to give out clues, because he felt it was too difficult, and actually included a little hint right in his log. I also had another pair of cachers bring their research material to an event, which in turn tipped off another cacher that was having trouble getting started. Needless to say, both actions left me feeling extreemly slighted. Why should I spend months of my time putting together what one cacher called "one of the top three caches within a 60 mile radius", if others are going to disrespect my hard work, and undermine my efforts? People have asked me questions about this cache, and sometimes I'll give a little hint, but only when I feel that the hint doesn't disrecpect the hard work other cachers may be putting into the hunt, who don't want to ask for help. As the cache owner, I feel it's my prerogative to decide which clues/hints get handed out, and which do not. --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------

quote:Originally posted by ErSamin:Another way to do a multi would not require you to place anything at the site. By providing a key in your description page (or just a simple letter to number conversion 'a=1, b=2'), you could direct the finder to complete the coordinates for the second stage of the multi by gleaning the information from the signs that exist at the refuge viewing area. (ie: 'N35.27.---, the seconds being the first letter of the first three words on the middle sign, converted as shown below') Just my $0.02 "Could be worse...could be raining" Excellent suggestion, and that option is probably a likely reason the cache wasn't approved. Virtuals are so incredibly easy to create that many people have gone totally overboard, which naturally necessitates the admins needing be be extra picky with them. I've been to and found (and hidden) several caches that required gleening info from a sign to compute the coordinates for the real cache, and I think it's an excellent alternative to just creating yet another mindless virtual. --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------

quote:Originally posted by AllenLacy:Well then you need to get rid of the last } or it will not compile. You're right. did it. --------------------------------------- "We never seek things for themselves -- what we seek is the very seeking of things." Blaise Pascal (1623-1662) ---------------------------------------