Ben0w

So you really put a NTF prize in? You wrote in your note: "Now"? Was it announced? "Next to find"? The watchlist or anyone reading the note has to understand this in the first place... "Found It", "Note"? Where is the connection to the prize? Don't I get it for simply finding it? So, I have to claim it? Where, how? Finding it isn't enough? What's that about logging ASAP? Is there a time restriction involved? Huh? It's a prize, why trading? ... from the mind of someone who just happens to stumble over your note and not being aware of this discussion. Don't know how many watchers are from the forums. Your target group (locals on watchlist, random note readers, people understanding what you're trying to say) probably is very small. But don't give up. Tell us what you put in!

Language on traffic signs and fuel prices changes. Unless at the swiss border you won't see any checkpoint at inner EU borders any more. However, be sure to obey custom laws, there are occasional "traffic control" checks in border regions. Doesn't matter. In EU countries you most probably won't be asked for it anyway and at the swiss border they treat all strangers with the same mistrust. Just be sure to stay on the right side of the road - which is the right side. Have a nice trip!

3. The archived cache is abandoned by the cache owner (shame shame!) but a geocacher, for whatever reason, goes out, finds it, and removes the geolitter, a find is perfectly acceptable in my book. Yes. But there are some practical problems with that: • why does the cacher search for the archived cache in the first place? If he knows it's archived, he should respect that. If not, well, then he doesn't even know, it's archived (D'oh!). • if he didn't know that it's archived, how should he determine it in the field? Internet access isn't everywhere. • even if he somehow learns on scene, it's archived: how does he know it's not active on another listing platform? Research? Internet access isn't everywhere. Better ask the owner! But that's not always possible on an outdoor trip. • If he could mail the owner what's up with the cache and what to do, most probably, the reply will not be in time the cacher is still at the hide... Just taking a cache without respecting CO's possession rights (and duties) because you think it's geo litter is not correct either. Determining this all in the field is very difficult.

Cool idea. But I guess noone understands your note...how to claim it (by a note? Not by just findig it in the cache?), trade or not to trade for it (you described both)? What and why is that anyway? Out of the context of this discussion this just gives a big question mark from the view of an innocent watcher...

Maybe in those ancient times where a phone actually was used for calling people?

#8 also is a false target for the irony. NM should really be used far more and the anxiety associated with NA already is enough.

Find counts, too, to begin with. :roll: But nothing to bother about. The cacher actually was FTF, so it's fine. He urgently wants this souvenir, for whatever reason. It doesn't hurt anybody else if he redates the log. It just tells a story about his caching ethics...

1. If archived (on any listing service), the cache is out of the game. 2. The box turned into geo litter and should have been taken away by the cache owner, so no find is possible. However, there is a grey area. If #2 hasn't happened (yet or because the CO doesn't know where it is) and the finder honestly isn't aware of the archiving, then I'd consider it a legal find. Just logging archived virtuals because no physical log is needed is foul play in my book...doesn't hurt anyone, but makes me laugh (again) about the significance of "found it" statistics. If #2 doesn't happen for a long time, it's bad. There may be a bunch of reasons. Then, local geocachers should offer the CO to help getting the trash out or take action in a reasonable way. Geo litter shouldn't exist.

Option 3: ask the cache owner for a translation.

Beware: a cache could be archived on geocaching.com but maybe active on another listing site! Mail the owner. Ask him politely to unarchive the listing (however, I think after more than three months this isn't possible any more), alternatively to tell you which other listing sites the cache belongs to or - if it's really inactive - to get his geo litter collected ASAP. If you happen to get there again, you could do the "trash out" part, if appropriate. Logging that as a found it is technically possible. Ethically, the cache is out of game, but if you honestly searched for it based on outdated information and signed the logbook, I don't see that as foul play. Your choice.

BTW: favourite points are clearly overrated. Not intentended (*), but I've got my souvenir from a 16 FP cache, which really is a PET preform sticked (AKA buried) in the ground, in open view beside a busy road, camouflage broken off. It is part of a power trail which may explain the load of FP this and other caches of the series get. To the positive, the trail provides some nice landscape views, is preferably done by bicycle and the owner takes care of it. The caches still are micros and nanos stuck in the ground, in bushes nearby power transformators, behind guard rails and in traffic signs - nothing special (CO has a home business selling caching equipment and this power trail is used to show what he has to sell: preforms, nanos, fake stones, fake screws, logbooks, ...). So, my point: FP tells you not much about quality of a cache, just a bit more about the frequency it is found. I wonder why that's worth a souvenir. However, I just think that those road trip 2015 souvenirs are thought encouraging geocachers to use the new designed search function. And a lot will do anything they could just to get the souvenir on their profile page, even if it involves cheating. *shrug* Can't wait to get the newsletter about new souvenirs for using the new message center. (*) happens to be on the way to a cache I considered cool.

Der Cache-Owner will ja, dass seine Coin discovert wird. Aber eben die Coin, nicht irgendeine Nummer auf einer schnöden Liste.

If the foil is intact, and the cork's in the bottle...I don't think there's a problem with that at all! Alcohol isn't considered family friendly. Hopefully you have taken proper care of it.

+1000

Now I know what's meant with "Groundspeak"!!!

I would consider this commercial (promoting a business) and thus against the guidelines The promotion rule is about a cache (description), not it's contents. The cache location is reached by a small path and provides a nice view. The restaurant just is nearby at the start of the path.

A definite note from the reviewer about insignificance of the "no trespassing" signs would surely calm down things. At the moment there are a lot of things still left open for discussion. Interesting is, that from the cited knowledge book article (see several posts ago) a cache can't be NA'd just for guideline violation (i.e. being buried) - read the article, a lot about permission and condition, nothing about guidelines. No wonder land managers don't trust geocaching as a whole. This and the choosen information politics including terse answers/actions from reviewers/HQ are poor performance in my view.

Did an FTF yesterday and got an unactivated trackable "First To Find Micro Geo-Award". Nice! FTF awards I included in my caches: • a 10 EUR voucher for the restaurant nearby, the FTFer choosed to have a drink at the bar • a big blue marble with the geocaching logo on it • an unactivated FTF geocoin (see picture posted here, the frog coin) - however, as already told, the finder never understood what an unactivated coin is for...(activation? huh?) • All of my caches had certificates. Once I found a small bottle of sparkling wine, decorated as FTF price. Despite not liking food in caches this seemed fresh enough, so we celebrated on the spot (and CITOed). However, meanwhile I considered this a dumb practise, not wanting to over-estimate the FTF sidegame anymore. But with yesterdays found of the FTF geocoin prize I might reconsider things. I was really pleased by this, so I think it indeed is a nice thing to include.

Deleting a trackables log does not undo the action. The best thing to do is just "retrieve it" and your "drop/retrieve" is the same as a "visit." You're right! I change my consideration to option #4: just "retrieve" it this time ("drop" and "retrieve" equals a "visit"), at the next cache think of "visit".

A simple log type change is not possible in this case, I think. Three options: #1 delete the trackables log entry, then log a "visit" #2 "retrieve" it, then log a "visit" #3 put the trackable into the cache. I'd consider #1 the cleanest option. Maybe there are more choices.

Once I put an unactivated coin in a cache for the FTF. The FTF cacher complained (!) about the coin "not working". The coin never was activated since then...(yes, I tried to explain the gift). *shrug*

On iPhone I use "Looking4Cache Pro" for my whole geocaching experience: cache management (lists, filters) including pocket queries, outdoor searching (very good battery life and offline features), offline logging/notes on scene for timestamp, then expanding my notes and sending online logs when I'm home. Great app! The lite version has all the same features except the offline maps. I use an additional GPS unit for backup, especially when on a longer walk.

Wouldn't that be a Multi with the puzzle attribute? Please think about the concept, it seems to me that there is internet access required while being outside? That is not generally the case, still true with a lot of people!

Yes to all above. It additionally helps to have a family including a dog with you. That makes you totally invisible in every stupid situation on any suspicious location.

Beachte auch typische Verleser: 0/O, B/8, Z/2, 1/I etc. Meist liegt es daran.