Coppers Lot

To highlight my seriousness here is an entry from the National Extremist Tactical Coordination Units website on Domestic Extremism: What is domestic extremism? Unlike terrorism, which is defined in the UK by the Terrorism Act 2000, there is no equivalent legal definition for domestic extremism. The terms are generally used to describe the activity, individuals or campaign groups that carry out criminal acts of direct action in furtherance of a campaign. These people and activities usually seek to prevent something from happening or to change legislation or domestic policy, but attempt to do so outside of the normal democratic process. Who are domestic extremists? Domestic extremism is most commonly associated with 'single-issue' protests, such as animal rights, environmentalism, anti-globalisation or anti-GM crops. Crime and public disorder linked to extreme left or right wing political campaigns is also considered domestic extremism. Clearly, the majority of people involved in animal rights, environmentalism and other campaigns are peaceful protesters and never considered 'extremist'. The term only applies to individuals or groups whose activities go outside the normal democratic process and engage in crime and disorder. Extremists may operate independently but will sometimes try to mask their activities by associating closely with legitimate campaigners. The police work hard to ensure that the majority of protesters can campaign peacefully while stopping the few individuals who break the law. What kind of criminal activity is involved? The tactics used by extremists vary and are always changing. Incidents have included public disorder offences, malicious letters and e-mails, blackmail, product contamination, damage to property and occasionally the use of improvised explosive devices. Domestic extremist campaigns rarely cause a danger to life, but in some cases the aim is to create a climate of fear. The entry talks about some really serious stuff but within it you can see echoes of GROEP activity.....

Since I posted this I had a thought. The thought occurs to me that this is indeed extremist action by persons unknown to the victim (geocachers) on the basis of some mis-guided eco theme. This comes under the guise of violent extremism and as a result is of big interest to my employers. Thames Valley Police as well as other national Police groups like SECTU and probably Special Branch. Time to gather information on these people; Is this a national issue or is it localised; if so where. What does Groep actually mean? Could somebody who knows more about this group, most likely from GAGB please contact me and I will create a small dossier and then submit intelligence in relation to this and see if I can raise their profile. Once identfied as an 'extremist' organisation which affects a large portion of the populace then I'm sure the powers that be will cast an eye in their direction. Littering may hold a fine of £1000.00 but cyber terrorism and violent extremism holds a lovely long jail sentance upon first conviction.

I posted a reply to a thread on this forum in regard to caches disappearing and mentioned Groep in my post. Imagine my surprise today when I log into my hotmail account to find I had received a PERSONAL threat from this group; > From: noreply@geocaching.com > To: *********@hotmail.com > Date: Sun, 29 Aug 2010 17:42:47 -0700 > Subject: [GEO] brownturdy contacting Coppers Lot from Geocaching.com > > ...now you've poked your head above the parapet and opened your fat gob, how long before your bits of trash disappear??? > > GroEP > > User's Profile: > http://www.geocaching.com/profile/?guid=88...4f-b08de5f86436 > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > This email was sent without a return email address. You will need to respond to this email through the Geocaching Web site. Visit http://www.geocaching.com/email/?guid=8860...4f-b08de5f86436 and log in to respond to the message. > > Forward abuse complaints to: contact@geocaching.com > The email had come to me via my profile page from a geocaching.com member called 'Brownturdy' looking at their profile I can account for three TB's that have been stolen as they are listed on the profile page. As you can imagine my response to this individual was less than savoury. I am therefore now very aware that they stalk this forum, losers, and I'd like to point out to them that they can take ALL my caches if they like but I will replace them all; For each cache that is stolen I will place a further 5 caches in my area. For each TB stolen I will place a further 5 caches in my area. I feel that this group miss the point. Its not the box, the nano, the ammo box that makes geocaching, its the places we visit with the people we do it with. Steal the physical cache if you like I'm paid enough that I can replace them ad infinitum; if you steal them so be it. I like the idea of you wasting your time, money and energy chasing my caches because you think you are a cyber-terrorist or an eco warrior. In the grand scheme of things you are nothing. HAPPY CACHING.

Now doing this for charity is a bloody good idea. I think you have sown a seed in my mind.... thank you.

Calling cards in micros wind me up........ they then don't close and I have to go and replace the log cos its soaked. I am an avid recycler of cards via my bin...... Cache in Trash out [;-)] I can see why people do it and I agree we all play differently which is what makes the sport all the better. Common sense should prevail.

Pushing the thread back on track I think there is a Quantity over Quality issue in the UK i.e. people are VERY eager to stick out a hundred little cache and dash caches rather than make the effort to put out good quality caches. Its the old 'its not about the numbers' addage...... we're being swamped by micro/small cache and dashes rather than good quality boxes. I agree with the thread originator.

Pushing the thread back on track I think there is a Quantity over Quality issue in the UK i.e. people are VERY eager to stick out a hundred little cache and dash caches rather than make the effort to put out good quality caches. Its the old 'its not about the numbers' addage...... we're being swamped by micro/small cache and dashes rather than good quality boxes. I agree with the thread originator.

In my area most easy to find traditionals are being marked 'premium member only' because people like grope will then have to pay a subscription to find them. We've lost a few in my area (South Northants). There are a HUGE number of caches for the non-premium member so I don't see that the odd few disappearing should be an issue. Unfortunately not everyone is trustable and if your paying a subscription your more likely to respect the effort other cachers have gone to to place the cache and also by paying the subscription you show you are serious about the sport.... There should be perks for the paying member and premium member only caches are it as it stands.

I recommend the one mentioned by Milvus-Milvus above.... one of my most enjoyable finds I think.

There is also this one which is similar. http://coord.info/GC197BF Yes there are. I have one: Transatlantic Teleporter that goes to the USA and there is one in Milton Keynes: Wormhole to middle earth which goes to New Zealand.... My cache has been bookmarked on a list of these caches; if you find my cache then you'll find the list.

Nice one Don (Zoid) I am amazed at how effective Geocaching is at bringing people from great distances together and developing friendships and relationships that can last an age. I'd like to pass my condolances on to Kens family for their loss. You are in my thoughts with the coming Christmas period. I am chuffed to see my name attached to such a lovely forum thread. Thank you Don.

How terribly sad. Our thoughts are for him and his family. Cat princess and Coppers Lot

I've come in to this quite late in the day but have noticed something about this thread which the offenders are undoubtedly reading too...... First thing I noticed when I read it was that it appeared as soon as a member pointed out how cheap premium membership was we lost some premiuim member caches..... this partially leads me to belive they read it as I know I would if I was them and take great delight in reading about our outrage and publisising their actions with a list of our lost caches like some kind of trophy list. Second thing I noticed is that they purport to be an environmentalist group..... they obviously are coming at this perceived 'issue' with a very narrow thought band as fundamentalists usually do as they are only focusing on the fact that we hide boxes in the country which they consider to be rubbish, pollutants..... blah, blah. They have failed to look at the positives of geocaching rather than this singular con. The other con possibly being fuel usage which really doesn't count as a lot of caching gets done 'on the way' to places so doesn't make the carbon footprint any bigger. Having spotted this I also noted that we as a group have done ourselves NO favours in this thread as we have flamed, and expressed a lot of outrage even suggesting we setup up OP's on caches to catch the offenders.... NO-ONE has expressed here in this thread what the pro's of Geocaching are!! On this point I think we should do a little advertising and passing on of information that they haven't obviously haven't grasped. Geocaching is a sport which promotes family togetherness, meeting new people, getting out of the house together to experience new places and learn new information. Exercise; whether that is walking or cycling (reducing the carbon footprint). Geocaching is a sport that takes its members to places of interest that they would never have known about or visited without geocaching being here and the many members bringing other members into their interests and local environments with their local knowledge. Geocaching makes use of the wide open spaces, the dwindling green zones of this country which are at risk of being developed. With the advent of CITO caching (Cache In Trash Out) geocachers actively help these green zones by taking home rubbish. I actively clear up the areas around my caches so that they look good when people come to visit. I have placed caches in places where there is rubbish and requested that cachers actively support me by clearing the areas and taking rubbish home with them. I have taken home bags of rubbish for correct disposal which far outway the very small plastic box I've hidden non intrusively in the hole of a tree. (reducing country pollutants) Geocaching supports local projects for instance: My church series placed near or within the confines of old churches promotes cachers looking inside the church. These cachers have then donated money which has supported the upkeep of these places. Other caches around the country support other historical places as cachers are VERY inquisitive people and also very generous people. Geocachers have contributed in other ways which would NOT have occurred had the not been out caching. I remember an account about cachers coming across a farm animal in distress who then contacted the farmer who called a vet. I know there are MANY other stories like this that just need to be told....... For Geocaching to be targetted over environmental issues is just short of astounding based on the many good deeds and environmentally caring things that take place. Above is just an account of my part of the sport; there are hundreds of thousands of other cachers ALL OVER THE WORLD doing the same as me. I'd appreciate an opportunity to discuss with anyone who wanted to Geocaching and what the perceived issues are. Maybe there is more we as cachers could do... The other reason for this intrusion, which I think people are hoping for, is that its kids. I don't think it is. Anything any other members want to add?

Off to Ironbridge next week-end, any must do caches? many thanks kev

If that was as a result of this thread deceangi then cool. It's a shame there are those who seek to spoil everything. I the thread owner request that you now lock and lose this thread.

Hi, I apologise if this fool has already been debated on the forum but I've been back three forum pages and seen nothing. I presume fool as he has NOT found any caches and only created his member name on the day of this entry: M1 Drive-By TB Hotel J15a has an entry on 25th January from a member called cachekiller002 stating 'CACHE KILLED' this cache was archived as it was muggled and its contents stolen. The entry was post-archive. Has anyone else seen entries from this person? Is he local to northants i.e. his entries are all in this area? Is Groundspeak aware of his activities or the possibility that he will be going around killing caches? wonder if he has the ammo box from my J15 Trainspotting cache....

oh..... I see.

I've released a number of TB's and I think I'm approaching 80% loss rate. Its frustrating when they travel so far and then disappear but equally as bad when they don't leave the first cache. I'm convinced some of mine have been due to new cachers not understanding or cachers deciding to let the kids have them. My mother and I have released Mcdonalds dogs as TB's and we've lost 100% of these, about 6 TB's, all over the world.... Oh and lets not forget cachers who pick them up and never place them again....... I spam them until they comply but I shouldn't have to surely!? As for the blackmail issue may I point that cacher towards the GAGB for advice. P.S. Whats TPTB?

Catprincess and i are interested in meeting up with you all. Let one of us know when the next meet is and we'll try to join you.

Soon you'll be doing daft things too like as many caches as you can stuff into 24hrs........... or how many thousands you can do in a year........... WELCOME I hope you enjoy it as much as i do........ remember its only a hobby...... <Dons TVP issue armour, grabs an armadillo shield and takes cover behind a carrier for the onslaught>

Fraser, I think having read as many repeated logs above as possible that there is NO set standard. So long as you've left your identifiable mark in the log book so that if asked you can point to it and say "THATS ME". The rest is handy, helpful, interesting, but, I would say NOT mandatory.

Rightly or wrongly with the exception of my LQ cache I've now set all my caches to PM only. I figure if they want to trash my cache then they'll have to pay for the honour of doing it! Not much use if they have a list of caches before you changed them A chance I'll have to take. So thats 19 caches in one area that are now ALL Premium members ONLY. Is that permanent or are you just doing it temporarily as that seems quite a shame for NON premium members in your area?

I'm trying to use the google map on an XP operating system with Internet Explorer.... this used to be fine but now when I extend the search for caches (zoom out or in) and it says 'parcing geocaches..' it throws up an error and runs forever. The error is: EO. Web controls client side Debug Message: An error occurred while applying the new output. Error message: failed This is a pain as I find this map exceptionally helpful.... not a very helpful error message!! Anyone know off hand of any issues or how I can fix this.......please?

Lol. I'm sure everyone will eventually have an encounter with the Police whilst caching, I'm surprised more of us don't. I'm fortunate that I have my own warrant card to flash back at the Police So far I've not been stopped. In the UK we have many official powers which allow us to officially stop and officially chat to people. I say officially as I stop people and chat to them all the time but it becomes official if I suspect something is not right or if I start asking you to account for your presence, possession of an item or where you've recently been. Most common are the 'Stop and Account' and the 'Stop Search', both require the poor police officer to fill out paperwork, they'd rather not but they have to... please don't moan. The stop search gives the officer the power to use force if necessary. If you're in certain other areas of the country then other blanket powers kick in like anti terrorism powers or powers in relation to weapons being carried. These powers are less common but they exist e.g. around Heathrow airport. Advice from a Police Officer: Be open, honest and nice. If you look suspicious, which we generally do, then being angry with a Police Officer for stopping you is just gonna ruin your day. Ultimately they are in just as much of a hurry as you and they hate the paperwork much more than you do. If you explain well then they will probably be most interested in what your doing and may even take a moment to help you out. It's happened.

I put TB's in the post, usually ask the owner if it's okay first, but i haven't lost any yet. Plus there are caches that are wormholes to other countries so the TB's get posted..........