Locke72

Hallo, bei einem Kumpel werden viele Geocaches, Myst und Earth generell, in der Groundspeak App auf dem iPhone grau angezeigt, und wenn er drauf klickt, dann steht da, daß er Premium Member werden soll. Leider steht das auch bei Geocaches da, die gar keine PMO-Caches sind. Weiß jemand woran das liegt? Locke72

PMO caches at themselves don´t disturbs me. It is difficult to explain it. Well, I will try: I made a very nice (PMO) cache tour through a forest. Very beautiful nature. As I said, a colleague of me wants to make this cache tour too. But he is just BM, so he can´t see them on geocaching.com. What I want to embody is, that it is a pity that he can´t see this caches. But now I can understand why people make PMO caches. In my area aren´t so many PMO caches as in most of your areas. I think that americans and germans are different kind of cachers. That´s ok so. And I also accept why most of you make their caches PMO. Most of your arguments are now comprehensible for me. But some of my arguments I will keep. :-) Again, thank you all very much for your answers, opinions and critics. And a good secondary effect is, that I learned a little more english. :-)

I understand and comprehend what you mean.

DUDE!!!! HELLO!!! You're a premium member!!! After all the answers I know that this Post is unhappy worded. :-)

Seriously I want to thank you for your answers, opinions and critics. I think that I slowly recognise why most of you make PMO caches.

Then I suggest you extend your opposition by not finding any more, and deleting your logs for the ones you have found. Yes, deleting your logs will teach those PMO cache owners a lesson! There´s no reason to be unobjective! You oppose PMO caches, yet you are willing to find and log them. Your actions go against your alleged ethics, my friend. Which side of your face do you wish to speak from? If you talk the talk, you need to walk the walk. I´m not premium member to hide or seek PMO caches, but I´m premium member to use the PM funktions of Groundspeak. And I don´t understand why my actions go against my ethics (which are real and not alleged)? I search the caches which I see on Groundspeak, I don´t especially search for PM caches. All I say is that it is a pity that not all can see this caches. And the argument, that it is an incentive for basic member to become premium members, is, from my sight, not right. People who I know don´t become a premium member because they have not enough time to cache continuously.

I think you don´t want to understand me. Ok, I have to live with it. I don´t mean that PMO caches are wrong, but I don´t recognize the meaning of it.

All your suggestions that I should give my colleague my passwort or give him the coordinates for the PMO caches make your arguments for PMO caches absurd.

Then I suggest you extend your opposition by not finding any more, and deleting your logs for the ones you have found. Yes, deleting your logs will teach those PMO cache owners a lesson! There´s no reason to be unobjective!

Thanks. :-)

Once again: I respect and accept all of your opinions, but I can´t retrace it. I believe, you don´t (want to) understand my opinion. I don´t want to affront you. And apparently there are different kinds of geocaching people in United States and Germany. Maybe we germans are to seriously. Many things you take more easy than us. But my opinion is still the same: I oppose PMO caches.

Why not just take him with you? Basic members are allowed to find and log PMO caches, they just can't view the cache listing. Because he works at other times as I do. We have shift work, so we can´t cache together every time. And he wants to cache this round. All your arguments, like "protect the caches" "Audit Logs" etc., are irrelevant, because even premium members are destroying caches, or dont´t handle it with care. This is no guarantee for "protected caches". In your arguments premium members are the well-behaved cachers and basic members are heedless.

I also had a scenario where some of the FTF crazies were not paying members, so making the caches PM only gave others a try at FTF. With the days of smartphone immediate notification of new caches, the FTFers got even more nutso around my area, so I basically gave up trying to have them not take all the fun from the newbies. Most of the FTF hunters around here are premium members! And they often hunt in tall groups. They call themselves "Team FTF" and something like this. And they trample heedless through the areas!

I will say that if there is really such a great difference between regular caches and PM caches in your area, that is highly unusual. Most PM caches in the US are in no way better than non-PM caches. The point is not the qualitative or what ever for a difference between regular caches and PM caches. I´m sure this difference is very small. Rather it´s a pity that basic members can´t see some of the wonderful and beautiful cache series. Here in my area is an wonderful cache round through an forest. But a colleague of me can´t enjoy this cache round in his homezone because he is no premium member. And he caches not so often like me, that´s why he don´t want to become a premium member. But he loves geocaching so much as I do.

Why are you calling yourself a snob? Stop hitting yourself. It´s difficult to put my thoughts in words when the usual language here is not my native language. Not a premium member is a snob, rather the PMO caches are snobby.

1st: The point is not how many basic member caches there are, but how many beautiful cache rounds and series they are out of reach for basic members. Why basic members should not enjoy this cache rounds and series. 2nd: I agree to you that the 30$ a year are an good income to keep alive Groundspeaks homepage. It´s the most used geocaching website worldwide. And the premium member functions are worth it to be pay for it.

If basic members may find and log the premium member caches too, the premium members caches are needless. In Germany are areas with less caches. And somebody who has no drivers license or vehicle comes quickly on the limit for geocaching his homezone. Besides there are very nice cache rounds or cache series in beatiful landscapes with 5, 6, 7 or more PM caches. I pity basic members who can´t enjoy this cache series or cache rounds.

1. "Snob" was the wrong description. I´m premium member too. I don´t want to affront anybody, espacially not myself. ;-) I was frustrated. I´m sorry! 2. My opinion is that geocaching should be available for all geocachers, even for basic members. I´m sure that even premium members are unintentional wasting or destroying caches, inadvertently keeping trackables without logging it, destroy cache areas during the hunt for caches. But of course I respect your oppinions. :-)

For my opinion this is not a question of payment. Even Premium Members can do the things you have described.

I wonder why some Caches are for Premium Members Only. For my opinion this is not the meaning of Geocaching. What is the difference to "Normal" Members?! Geocachers, who needs it exclusive, can open their own "Private Exquisite Geocaching Community"! Geocaching should be for EVERYONE who is interested in, not only for a few selected Snobs. Are the people, who hides Caches for Premium Members Only, thinking that they are something better?! They pay not for exclusiveness, rather for a few exclusive functions!

This is the "Feature Discussions and Suggestions" forum. What feature or suggestion are you proposing? If you only intended to post yet another tired old rant against PMO caches, you should do a search of the forums in order to find other rants of this sort. B. Ok, i re-posted it in "Geocaching Topics".

I wonder why some Caches are for Premium Members Only. For my opinion this is not the meaning of Geocaching. What is the difference to "Normal" Members?! Geocachers, who needs it exclusive, can open their own "Private Exquisite Geocaching Community"! Geocaching should be for EVERYONE who is interested in, not only for a few selected Snobs. Are the people, who hides Caches for Premium Members Only, thinking that they are something better?! They pay not for exclusiveness, rather for a few exclusive functions!