Roman!

Should GS decide it's ok for a challenge cache to be logged as found by those not meeting the challenge I would immediately archive my challenge caches. I put in a lot of effort to qualify for my challenges before publishing them and will not let anyone that hasn't log them. You'd better go and archive them now, because they all appear to have been found and logged by a number of people who haven't qualified. http://coord.info/GLGZ423F http://coord.info/GLGBV5V1 http://coord.info/GLGBDRPH http://coord.info/GLGZ40GT Those are notes and I clearly stated logged as found. Big difference, but you already knew that. .

So the real problem with challenge caches is that they challenge new cachers to find more caches? Isn't more cachers finding more caches beneficial to a company that makes money from geocaching?

I see one of the main complaint being challenge caches have ALRs, so do earthcaches.

Last time I checked, volunteer reviewers were, um, volunteers. Austin Volunteer reviewers don't handle appeals GS does and last time I checked they make money, they should be happy the have volunteer reviewers or they'd have to do even more work and might have to place a moratorium on all new caches.

Should GS decide it's ok for a challenge cache to be logged as found by those not meeting the challenge I would immediately archive my challenge caches. I put in a lot of effort to qualify for my challenges before publishing them and will not let anyone that hasn't log them.

You do realize that if cachers quit placing new caches GS will wither and die right? They're already making it more and more difficult, why make it impossible? I don't understand this moratorium just because it's work, aren't you getting paid?

You do not have to alter anything. If I see a Challenge I do not find interesting, I just don't do it. I really don't care if there's a 1000 day streak cache down the street from my house. Why do people feel they need to find everything out there. There are plenty of lamp post caches around here that I dislike even more. I don't sit here and bitch about them. I simply ignore them. Exactly. I have never understood that argument. You don't have to find everything. There is a great mechanism in place...the ignore list. Sorry, but the ignore list isn't as great as advertised. Caches can only be added to an ignore list one by one. In one of these threads someone mentioned that they had 700 challenge caches within 30 miles of their home location. Why should someone that doesn't want to find a certain type of cache have to go through the process of adding each cache, everytime a cache of that type is published? An ignore list doesn't stop notifications of new cache of a type one has no intention of finding from getting sent their email. Not only does someone have to go through the process of adding these caches to an ignore list they have to delete the 700 email message from their inbox. Then there is the simple fact that ignoring something doesn't make it go away. Ignore a cache only hides it from pocket queries, displaying on the map, etc. It doesn't stop it from impacting the game in general. Challenge caches definitely do have an impact on the game, even when some people ignore them, and that impact is not always positive. Finally, it's really easy for someone that likes a certain type of cache to tell someone else to just ignore them. However, that completely dismisses the concerns someone has about said cache type. Although on an entirely different scale it's sort of like a rich person telling a poor person to ignore the fact that they have no money and can't afford food. I understand your points and they are a valid concern for many geocachers. But you can apply those arguments to any cache type. For instance, if I don't like tree climbs, which can impact the game, I don't expect Groundspeak to make it easy for me to deal with them on the map, in e-mail notifications or PQs. My only option is to ignore them. Sure, but there is a matter of scale, and the amount of impact a cache type has. I haven't seen multiple power trails of tree climbing or scuba caches, or parks completely saturated with them. I doubt that you'll find any place in the world with 700 tree climbing caches within 30 miles. If I choose to ignore a tree climbing cache it's my choice (mostly because, at my age I physically can't do them). What I object to is someone that can, and likes a certain type a cache telling me that if I don't like them I can just ignore them. Whether or not I personally might not like a cache is irrelevant. Telling me to ignore them dismisses what I may feel are valid reasons for how a specific cache type is influencing the game. I hate puzzle caches and there are close to that in my area.

Why would those containers turn into geotrash? Did the hiders never intend to maintain their cache? When one submits a cache they agree to a maintenance plan. That guilt trip should be laid on the hider, not on Groundspeak. I could see a lot of people being frustrated and just saying to heck with it, I could be wrong and every cacher that now has a defunct challenge cache either republished it as another type or picks up the container.

I'm sure that is disappointing to you, and I'm also certain that you're not alone. But what else are they going to do? Any more advance notice would have simply had a whole bunch of people trying to submit their ideas at the last minute, deluging the reviewers. I really don't believe your fear of disallowing them is warranted, although that would be my desire. No... they are too popular for Groundspeak to ban them. I'm sure they are simply trying to arrive at a set of cohesive boundaries. Maybe that will work, maybe it won't, but at least I'm glad to see them recognizing the problems and trying to fix them. They could have cut it off at a GC code so any in the works could still be published, wondering how many containers were already place that will now turn into geotrash.

Just curious, what's a bad one? There's some I like some I don't but doesn't mean others won't.

Yes please, that way I could filter out all those pesky puzzles and as for challenge stars, not just no, but heck no!

I don't. The OP was merely reacting to the rudeness and aggressiveness of others. Good for her for standing up for herself. I actually felt that had the moderators intervened much sooner we might not have this mess. I disagree on your first point, the OP was very aggressive to start with and got worse from there, I do however agree on your second point.

I hope those that apologized on behalf of others please recant their apology on behalf of others.

Yes, and it's beginning to feel like a tedious labour now as most of it was nothing to do with my original post. And I have only just asked about tourists leaving caches, then returning back to their own homeland. What happens to these caches? Are they just left there, or what? Yes, I did see a few with the spanner icon and worked it out. but the sheer volume must mean that a lot are still left lying around, and it is those ones I am wondering about too...Like how long can a cache be left for with no one having found it? I've seen a lot that have been cached for years and it looks like it's just been forgotten about. How can one tell the responsible party is still being responsible? Of course this is a valid part of the conversation, but with so many posts it's hard to actually get down to it. And I am totally solutions orientated, hence my stating earlier that I am going to look into the science abit more deeply. Just because everyone believes xyz is the right thing, it does not necessarily mean they are right. Sometimes the lone voice is the right voice. I'm not saying I'm the lone voice by the way. So what? A few plastic containers get abandoned, the overall impact of geocachiers on the environment is a positive one. There are some 2.5 million geocaches world wide, let's say every year 1% get archived, that's 25,000. Now I'd be surprised if half are plastic, we are down to 12,500 and if geocachers are really bad only half pick up their containers that leave 6,250 small pieces of plastic left out worldwide, where exactly is the problem? Just one well attended CITO can pick up that much trash in one day.

What's there to discus? The environmental impact of all the geocaches in the world is negligible, even not counting all the trash geocachers haul out of the environment. I'm sorry but if you think geocaching has any serious environmental impact you need to give your head a shake

5 minutes?

And thus ends the OP loving kumbaya, took way too long.

I am guessing it is somebody that knows about geocaching and cares about the environment and the world around her and has come here to ask us to be careful. I find your post to be very rude to a caring newcomer. Please be polite. Would you treat a guest in your house like that? Oh thank you, that's a lovely way to put it. And in a nutshell too. Im not here to find fault with the activiity, in fact I think it's a great idea. I just have one little concern and rather than over react I thought I would voice it here first to give anyone who wants to respond the opportunity to respond....and take it from there. Yes, I sense that. And you have been more than polite despite some very rude responses. Thanks for taking the high road, and I hope the moderators spot this thread soon and start to rap a few knuckles. May I ask how you learned about geocaching and what brought your attention to this issue? I think this thread is the definition of overreaction by the OP, don't know why you are buttressing him/her up. Speaking from personal experience, if you suspect someone is trolling, it is best to report it and allow the mods to figure it out. Trolling was my impression early on and either knowschad is doing a major league troll of the troller or.......I'm not gonna finish this sentence.

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Sorry, I dont understand why a park would require a clear plastic bag? Here a park could be anything from a kiddies playground, to a field that has been nicely mown (see croke park) , to a football pitch, to grand elaborate landscaped garden. Geocaching for many is a hobby and every hobby has some impact on the environment, heck just living does but over all geocachers clean up a lot more than they leave behind. Good plastic containers are practical for geocaching, cheap and watertight, there is no need to reinvent the wheel. I'm sure you can find a different group that offends a lot worse to go focus on or better yet go invent a "better" container and make a fortune.

Which is exactly why there is nowhere in the world without plastic and other POPs. I live in Canada, which is home to some of the largest tracts of forest in the world, and I would expect to find traces of plastic and other POPs anywhere, even in the most isolated places. A tiny little overcrowded island like Ireland? Pfft. Given I don't know you from Adam,...I have to ask..... do you normally respond to people in such an arrogant and rude manner? Yes, unfortunately, she does. I apologize for her. While some of us beg to differ with you on this matter, I do see you as someone with a love for the environment, and as a geocacher, I thank you for that! i didn't know you had a sense of humor?

The real victim of power trails seems to be the sense of humor.

Why is it funny to attack people's geocaching profiles in the forum? Wow

And which cache would that be? Geocaches Owned Name Count Total Caches Owned No hides have been recorded. Uh, dude, it's no big secret that some users, including this one, have hides with other accounts. What, exactly, is the purpose of combing through someone's profile because they disagree with you? That's just creepy. Never would have occurred to me as its against the rules. Against what rules? Please, go ahead and report me to the authorities for breaking the rules by helping my husband create geocaches on his account. Again, what is the purpose of combing through people's profiles? What does that possibly contribute to the discussion? My apologies, I knew I should have put a at the end of my post.