WOW sorry for wanting to help improve our caching community... Ya know I was always taught that no question is a bad question and the only bad question is the one unasked.. wow i never would have thought i would be a part of a community that doesn't want to help each other out.. the cachers i have met down here in florida and around the world have been real polite and respectful people.. sorry to ask a question in this community.. i will stick to my friends.. this is what our community need to grow and be prosperous trite people.. haha...