lost02

Bill93, thanks for the reply. We were initially thinking the same thing - we don't know why it was solid now. Gnikhog’s point about letting the professional determine what they want to do made sense (and from the looks of the area it has been used), but there is a possibility that the history may not be read (as you suggest). The pipe cap did appear to be visually level, and since the entry in 1979 a Witness Post has been added to the site, but that doesn't prove anything. When we are in doubt I shoot Deb an email, but I hate sending something in to her when there is a clear cut way things are supposed to done.

Gnikhog - that's true. Our observations were that the pipe is (now) stable/good. As you suggest any professional that wants to use the mark will read the history and determine for themselves how/if they want to use the mark.

We just recovered a mark (Pipe Cap) that was last described in 1979 as Poor “THE MARK IS LOOSE IN THE GROUND AND WILL NOT BE LEVELED TO ON THIS SURVEY. THE MARK WAS NOT DESTROYED.” On our visit the mark was not loose. Should we still recover it as “Poor” since we don’t know if it was leveled properly (maybe it just settled?)? Note that we plan to update the description to indicate the mark isn’t loose in the ground, but don’t know if it’s considered “Poor” or “Good”. Thanks.

No luck for us at DA1585.

BB - I had attempted to contact the ADOT about another mark in the past and was unsuccessful, though I may try again. 2OF - yeah, all discs (including the RMs) have a single date stamp of 1987 on them.

m&h, yeah no dates are in the box score area, and there aren't two dates stamped on the each disk, so we were thinking the data sheets have a typo. All three marks are adjusted and we easily located them with our GPSr. We rarely write down the coordinates from our GPSr with adjusted coordinates because the adjusted coordinates should always be more accurate than our GPSr. We took some measurements at these locations, but none that would confirm/deny the RM distances.

We were out last weekend and three of the marks we recovered were dated 1986 in the data sheets, but all three are stamped 1987 (CG1184, CG1197, CG1203). We were thinking that the Arizona Department of Transportation was having a bad day when they logged these and really meant to say the date stamp was 1987. Should we assume the data sheets are correct and all three of these just happen to be resets (logged as not found), or log them as found with a warning that the date on the marks are all 1987, while the data sheets show 1986? Due to all thee being wrong the same way, at different locations along the road, and the additional recoveries since 1987, we’re leaning toward “found” with a warning.

Paul - thanks for the link/tool. We have the PID and recovery pages bookmarked and never even looked at the home page to see what was there. Guess we'll spend some time looking at what’s available. BTW - got the tool to work OK. Thanks!

BDT - great, thanks!

I was wondering how to read the location for reference marks. After the distance there is typically a 5 digit number. Is it dddmm from the mark? Here’s an example: KV5907|--------------------------------------------------------------------- KV5907| PID Reference Object Distance Geod. Az KV5907| dddmmss.s KV5907| CS3443 BLUEBELL RM 2 19.040 METERS 20832 KV5907| KV6107 BLUEBELL AZ MK 437.932 METERS 2153724.5 KV5907| CS3442 BLUEBELL RM 1 12.612 METERS 34020 KV5907|--------------------------------------------------------------------- Would RM1 be about 13 meters North/Northwest from the Mark?

Z15 – OK, thanks - "NOT FOUND" it is. I was going by the History for QL0672 where every entry is “GOOD”. I guess the difference is that when you found it broken off you logged how you reset it where in CY1254 there’s no mention of what happened?

Z15 – thanks for the info. So then based on your log entry I would log it as “Good”, or “Poor” (since there is no reference to how it was reset). I was going to use this for the text: Use with caution. The Station Mark and Reference Mark 1 now have an additional date stamp of 1999 (1985 and 1999). Reference Mark 2 has a date stamp of 1985. Also note that U.S. 666 is now U.S. 191.

Thanks for the responses. The description and coordinates match the data sheet. It looks like the discs (Mark and RM1) had originally been stamped with 1985 and the 1999 date was added under it (the “19” in “1985” looks like it was made with the original disc and the “85” was stamped, while the entire “1999” looks stamped). I’m thinking these are the original discs, but as Bill93 said they may have been disturbed in a car accident, or by some machinery. If these are not the original discs then they are Not Found, if they are the original discs that were disturbed and reset/replaced should they be recorded as Poor, maybe they were just re-stamped in 1999 (like this recent thread - note that was a RESET mark without the word RESET on it)?

We just recovered CY1254 (LONE) (we haven’t logged it yet) and noticed the mark has a date stamp of 1985 and 1999 (the NGS data sheet only shows 1985). In 2003 the NGS marked it as “Not Found” because the date stamp was “LONE 1985 1999” not “LONE 1985”. The mark doesn’t have RESET on it, so how should it be recovered? Note that RM1 is also “1985 1999” where RM2 is actually just “1985”. Maybe they lost their RESET stamp in 1999?

IE 6.0 used to work fine with me – doesn’t work since the upgrade. Every time I open a new browser I have to log in again – even though I say remember me. I tried setting my privacy down to “Accept All Cookies”, and even cleared my cache, but it still requires me to log in every time I open a new browser. Hey – it just started working again, thanks for the fix!

Woody – sometimes it has been only a few days, though usually a number of weeks. It all depends on her schedule. You can always look up the PID in the database and see if it has been marked as destroyed. mloser – yeah, when I send in a potential mark to be destroyed I typically ask Deb if she wants me to enter it in the database as poor/not found or if she wants to mark it as destroyed. I can not always judge for myself what is considered to be destroyed (sometimes it’s obvious, other times not), so I just leave it up to her.

Woody – Hi, we haven’t been recovering benchmarks nearly as long, or done as many as others here, but we have submitted a few “destroyed” marks. Sometimes we have asked for advice here (don’t want to make a big mistake), and have learned that Deb is very friendly when you submit a report. Your mark looks very similar to one we submitted (actually your pictures may be even better because you can submit “before” and “after” pictures). If you could get a picture that has the same angle as the other two pictures that shows the 7-11 in the background, and get that close-up that you lost that would help a lot (Deb appreciates area shots along with the “close up” picture of where the mark should be located). Deb will keep your evidence - your email and pictures on record if/when she marks it as destroyed. If you think that you have the evidence the mark is destroyed you can submit it to Deb – the final arbiter - and see what she thinks. Don’t forget to submit the details: pictures, PID, Designation, date, who you are, description of what you found/didn’t find.

Thanks for the work you do! I thought I was seeing things this morning because the colors appeared to have changed from yesterday. Guess they did.

The Lowrance web site is pretty accurate. The Go2 just has a slightly better map (not as good as downloadable maps), and the Go is yellow, while the Go2 is red. Oh, yeah - no SD card slots.

seventhings - Thanks. Based on the stamping we knew we didn’t find the mark that was in the database, but were unsure how to log the entry properly. When we take off our geocaching hat and put on our benchmarking hat an accurate report – Found, Not found, Destroyed – all “count” the same to us.

seventhings - thanks. This is the first time we've found a RESET station that wasn't in the database and we weren't sure how to record it (since we didn't find the mark that is in the database).

Hi. How do you record (here and NGS) a "RESET" mark when the NGS database doesn’t show the mark as reset? For example, TU0299 is supposed to be designated 2-9 - 1969, but the actual station is 2-9 RESET 1994. Thanks.

Here's one we recovered recently: DU2362. You can see the stainless steel rod when the cover is open (it has a rounded/curved top/edge). Most of the time when we recover these we have to dig out some dirt to get down to the rod. Once we had to remove the remains of a palm tree!

2oldfarts – thanks for the test results. Guess you have the VLF/Pioneer – sounds like it does the job. We haven’t searched out of the valley yet, but I’m sure we’ll branch out eventually.

Photobuff - thanks for the info. We really don't want to spend a lot on the metal detector, but we do want to spend enough so that we have a useful tool. One mark we couldn't located is probably buried only a few inches under some hard pack soil. Another is under an unknown amount of vegetation/rocks/dirt/etc (no snow out here ). I'm sure we'll need it for others. We would like to just make one purchase and not have to go out and get another one later.