phoenix-rose

Hi Erik, I left mine pristine, but they're in a plastic case. They all have bright green labels on them that say DO NOT KEEP- TRAVEL COIN!! LOG ME! On a side note, I did a rough count, and we're looking at about 240 coins that have either been given away or placed in caches! Thought that you'd like to know! ~Rose ed to add color

Here's my thought - yes, of course, in a bright color... but maybe signal out with a gps and a trash bag in the other hand.. meeting BigFoot in the woods - also with a trashbag. Words of: CITO You never know who you'll meet! or CITO - it's an adventure! (if you use my idea, I want a T-shirt!!)

Agreed Hobbycache. I was shocked when I had a cacher this last week put one of my coins (which just barely started) in a 5/5 cache called Amadeus. I thought Oh MY GOSH it's never gonna move... Oh well, and kind of wrote it off. Less than 2 days later, the puzzle was solved, the cache found (the warning says DO NOT GO ALONE) and my little coin (Back Brake Billy) is moving along again. How cool is that?!? RE the contact in Iraq, I had one, but he's headed home in 2 weeks. Not enough time to get him coins for caches - since the mail is slow. I'll keep working on it. ~Rose

KiltedCacher - please see the link in my signature below - there's a bunch of people in the thread who are looking for coins to pop into caches around the world - if you're interested in these getting out and about. (Including military units in Afghanistan and Iraq...) ~Rose

Cool - 3 War Vet (he's in Afghanistan) has 1 coin coming from me - California Big Bear and 1 from Damenace - Nelson Geocaching around the world (to put in caches), and a little gift (maine) coin for him too. I looked all over to see if I had an extra Texas, and didn't. This is awesome - I think I counted a total of 14 caches there - that makes the cache run numbers about 50%? If anyone wants a contact in IRAQ, Let me know - I have one there too who will distribute to caches.

Ok - does it have to be coins? UTAH geocachers here held several events where invitees brought toys to donate to local charities for kids.... In my area, I got about $450 worth of toys for the Salvation army angel tree... Can I add it in? ~Rose

Beautiful - and thanks for making them in 2 obviously different metals! You heard my rant before I posted it! ~Rose

agreed - maybe one shiney and one antiqued? Something.. Anything to make them easy to tell them apart. I have a huge collection of geocoins at this point, and about half I know are LE, and those that I don't, I wind up having to ask someone else and/or hope I can guess. (I'm sure I'm not always correct.) Add into it that I'm trying to put coins in caches, If I have 1 LE and 4 regular, I will want to keep 1 LE and 1 regular, and put the other 2 in caches. Um.. Ya.. which one was the regular again? Can't tell.. Uh.. OOPS... that was the LE.. and now it's long gone... <sigh> and most likely muggled.... SINCE I KNOW NONE OF US would keep the coin for ourselves.. It never happens.... ~Rose

he he he Now you're right - that was clear as mud (or telling the difference between some of these coins!) Ok I admit that I can tell the difference between the AL and the not another micro. However, I can't tell a difference between AL and AL LE and the Not Another Micro/not another FTF without alot of examination.

Exactly my point - 2005 looks the same except for a teeny tiny FTF up in the corner. Don't get me wrong, I love the coin - it's just that it's difficult to tell (not blatently obvious at first look - you actually have to get them in the light, tilt them around and then check for the FTF on this coin) if it's the LE or not. The 2006, however, has a difference in color so you can visually see it. Ed for clarity.

Rant: Ok why do these coin groups make coins that are regular edition and limited editions that are in the same/similar metals and look practically the same. Take, for example the Mississippi coins. They're beautiful. However, you can't really tell the difference between the two - antiqued silver and antiqued nickel.... Another example would be the Not Another Micro 2005, and the AL 2006.... And it doesn't stop with these three editions... IMHO, if you're going to make a limited edition, it NEEDS to be SIGNIFICANTLY different than the regular coins. (Say copper for one and silver/nickle/gold for the other) It's hard enough keeping them seperate, but come on, how do I know for sure that I really got the LE and a Regular coin - when visually they are almost (if not exactly) the same.... Perhaps they're the same and we're all just being faked out... That and it's really hard to tell what I'm trying to trade for, and if I got the right one shipped or received. ANYONE ELSE have this problem? Thoughts? ~Rose

Welcome JeeperMTJ and Rebel! Glad to have ya!

Ok I love the idea. I think it would most likely be easiest out of something like copper - just for the simplicity of being able to "break" it later. Copper is relatively soft and easily scratched/bent so... there you go. ~Rose

Hi guys! I just wanted to note that the experiment is working - One of our locals here found a coin in a cache earlier this morning - then came to a little party we were having for him when he found his 100th find. He was soo happy - came up to me and said.. You wanna trade this for something (knowing I'm a collector)? I asked how he got it and when he told me I explained about the experiment. He said that in 1000 finds, it was the first coin ever. He gave me the coin so I could put a label on it (he's now logged it too!) and then get it on it's way. I currently have the coin (will label it as a travelling geocoin) but in the meantime, I thought the little detail above was great - and especially think it's cool to know it's working. Thanks to all the folks participating! I can't wait until my day to find one "IN" a cache. ~Rose

I'd be interested in the Oklahoma Native Americans email sent to you. Thanks!

Ok Instructions Simplified: Keep in mind that the basic premise is to get coins "into the wild"..... In order to qualify for the Special Group Coin purchase, you must complete both parts of the GeoCoin GiveAway...only do 1 part?...no coin... The 6 coins involved, do not have to be identical... You may enter as many times as you wish, but only get 1 "special participation" coin regardless of how many coins you send out/enter into the process. Part 1. Coin owner sends Person A 3 ACTIVATED (if trackable) coins to be distributed in caches. NOTE: Accepting the 3 "cache" coins does NOT qualify you in any way...the "Coin Owner" is the only one able to claim that as Part #1. Part 2. Coin Owner sends persons B, C, and D "incentive" coins - 1 each (NOT ACTIVATED if trackable). These coins are for them to keep or to register and/or put into a cache. These are sent in hopes that they will then do Part 1 themselves and keep the Experiment going. As far as the accepting the coins. If you want an incentive coin, that's fine. For each insentive coin, you would need to distribute 3 more Activated coins to caches and then 3 more incentive to keep the system going. Basically, you are sending out 6 and getting 1 in return. Does this help? ~Rose (edit to clarify the not activated part)

Hi Erik, You can do either. Some of us found it easier to contact the people from the forum whom already said they would be willing to send the coins to caches because we wanted them to go to a specific area. Others of us wanted to be contacted because we didn't have a list running (the list I posted at the top was just a collection of people from in the forum and my email that I didn't ship to) and had posted to other boards that we were looking for someone in area x or y or whatever. Which ever is the most convienient for you is the best. Also, when you go to distribute, don't forget to post what you've shipped where to the yahoo groups at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/GeocoinGiveaway/ So that you can qualify for the special "coin". In the meantime, welcome, and thanks for helping out our efforts! Rose

First, can I just say I’m definitely learning my geography much better in the last 3 weeks! Secondly, Thanks for all those that want to distribute.... Now, the Latest additions (whom I haven’t seen reply they’ve got coins headed their way) sorted by country: Deuil&Data – Germany sTeamTraen – France phamtom – Quebec (French Speaking) Canada Firth of Forth – Scotland part of UK Nellies Knackers – UK Phillimore Clan – Oxfordshire UK area Gralorn – Wiltshire UK Sensei TSKC – Buckinghamshire UK The Royles – South Wales UK Bilskirnir – Yorkshire/North Lincs UK Paul & Ros – UK HazelS – UK Team Maddie UK – UK svekke – Stockholm Sweden KiwiLegend – New Zealand ssarc – New Zealand phoenix-rose – Utah (western) United States Damenace – Utah (western) United States ParentsofSAM – Georgia (south Eastern) United States warthog – South Africa geocacher_coza – South Africa From before (feel free to contact these guys – I haven’t done so and they said they wanted coins to distribute…) geopeitur301 - will distribute to Estonia (there are few caches and no geocoins there - great place to send a few!) West468 - will distribute to Münster, Germany area hikerbiker - will distribute to Finland Team Firefox - will distribute to Finland MAntunes - will distribute to Lisbon Portugal area (you may want to PM him - our email keeps filtering both my email and his responses for some reason) Pablo Davalos - will put them in Mexico

well, it'd be dumping in caches (where I'd want the tracking), trading, and then a handful for eBay... The problem I'm seeing is that I didn't want to do the gc.com tracking (too much moola)- I wanted my own tracking set up... what I understand is that can't be posted here - trade or no trade. So, I'm trying to figure out if I want to rethink right now doing them at all. (feeling discouraged, though if I get a tax return I might not feel so discouraged...) ed. for clarification....

Geocoins started as Sig items that were left in caches and traded in caches. I think if you still want them for this purpose (that is how I read your post), then there is no issue. The rules have nothing to do with the true caching part. This has all come about because "sig" items are now being sold, not traded in the caches where they should be. If we all go back to the our caching roots this is a non issue. You're correct - that's mostly what I want them for - and as a trade item for those few I'd like to get (in particular some of the coins with dragons on them...) But with the extra $1.50 almost manditory for tracking per coin to post it here should I want to offer a few to newly starting people and/or do centralized tracking it's really hard on my pocketbook. By comparison, the hand sculpted sig items that I do take me somewhere around an hour each to make, but the cost is about $0.25 in materials. Yes, I number them, but I can't track them since they generally are traded for other sig items and/or get picked up first thing from a cache (they don't move). I know realistically, if I were making minimum wage, the metal coins are comparative in price, but it still *feels* less expensive making the sculpty coins as I go along. It also seems more "personal".... Of course, I also have to figure that if I put a coin in a cache, does this count as a trade item or a sig item? I put some kind of sig item in almost every cache I find now... but if I had a coin, would I keep doing this, or would it be only really "special" and "worthy caches" because of the extra added expense? (throwing a 0.25 cent sig item and a couple nice dollar store items in a cache with mostly "leftovers" is one thing, but a $7 coin is another...) ~Rose

Thanks Eartha, first off for reading that LONG WINDED post! Pesonally, I think I would be most interested for some info re B & C even if D is difficult, just some perspective (I know geocoins are new). I'm really finding it hard right now to be motivated to make the coin I want to because it's so much more than just doing the signature items I have are. I think it would last longer, but boy is it alot to put it out there. *sigh* I hope that the powers that be do decide to rethink the cost per coin and lessen it - but then... like everything, there's a cost. I just hope that it's not cost-prohibitive to those that are really trying to make a go of the hobby and the coins hobby that spring off of it.

Oh my gosh that was long! I didn't even realize it as I was typing. Thanks for bearing with me.

Ok Jeremy and the moderators, I have some LEGITIMATE QUESTIONS/CONCERNS for those of you who can perhaps answer them. I appreciate your taking the time to read this and if possible respond to what you are able. I'm not posting this as an attack or even criticism, but rather as someone trying to understand the geocoin policy change and the fees related to the situation overall. First, I work for an internet auction service (y'all can take 3 guesses on who it is and the first one you name will prolly be it) but many of you already know this. Because of this, I have a rational comprehension of costs to running a site that gets at least 100 times the hits that this one does. Yes, I understand completely about the cost for bandwith, additional servers, redundancies, and so on. As a site grows, I know that this cost doesn't go down. I see that my annual fee for geocaching.com is $30 a year. I am ok with this. I understand that this is a service provider with database maintenance and coding that all has to be kept in place. To me, this is a nominal fee for a sport and hobby that I *LOVE* and can do with my family, my friends, and my dog. IMHO, the fee is worth it. (How many $30 do I spend on stupid piddly things in a year that I really don't need or enjoy half as much - think 30 items off the Wendy's 99 cent menu - FROSTY in particular - and you get the idea of my thoughts!) The fee for this service is reasonable. Now, I guess my questions are the following (again, not attacking, just asking logical questions) : A) From my understanding, the moderators and those who approve caches are (among other things) ALL VOLUNTEERS. Is this correct? If so, it would seem that in the grand scheme of things, you have maybe say 25 people (please correct here because I'm going off what it seems like to the average user) that would run this site and need to be paid (That's giving alot - the site I work for has millions of members and about 4000 people working for it). I feel that this is what our $30 a year pays for in addition to the bandwith, maintenance, etc. Logically, I note that you have at least some income coming in from advertising, and sales of branded items, including clothing, travel bugs, and trackable geocoins. I'm not saying you can't make a profit, or protect the community, or plan for future expansion. Which brings us to question B. I agree with the tracking on coins in one central location thing - regardless of whether it's your site or Joe Schmo's. I admit I have a preference for your site's trackable coins, and unless I know the person have drastically tapered off on buying non trackable personal coins. To me, It simplifies things for all cachers - regardless of native language if they're almost all trackable in one place. (For example, I can't imagine finding a coin that is trackable on site xyblahblah.com and made it all the way from Greece but I can't read the instructions to track its travels let alone know which site I need to log that funny little number on, trying on GC and then finding it doesn't work...and then keeping it thinking it was a trade item - and we ALL know this happens!) In addition, I would like to make my future coins trackable on your site and am willing to pay a NOMINAL fee for that priviledge. However, at present I don't see the *VALUE* in the $1.50 service of YOUR generating the tracking number. Can you please explain to me the *VALUE* and/or rationalize why it's $1.50 (as in what portion of my 1.50 is actually going to bandwith, etc on average - I know with the company I work for we have to justify everything especially when fees are discussed in light of earnings announcements)? There is obviously some logic behind it, though I don't quite understand why it's so much. From our perspective, basically, the database for geocoins was already in place with the travel bugs. This didn't require all brand new programming - just a few extra columns in the database specific to the coin's tracking number possibilities. From a programming perspective, you can generate these as a numeric code that simply moves "up" one number/letter. So you tell it you want UT0000, then UT0001, UT0002 and so on. Once the programming is in place, you simply have to enter a "new" letter code for the next coin issue and the tracking numbers start again. Again, it doesn't seem to require an entire re-write of the code base for the coins or subsequent tracking numbers though I know it does require bandwidth. Now, I have no objection to you making a small profit on the tracking numbers, but really, to me, $1.50 does seem a little high. I mean I would be willing to pay $0.50 a coin, and say $50 for the extra icon (I mean I *do* have to design the new icon myself) or maybe a little more (say $75) if you were designing the icon. (Graphic designers are a dime a dozen these days, so for one little piece of artwork that size, I know I would pay maybe $75 in the real world..if that...for 3 hours of work) To me, though, it seems like you're doing very little work for that extra $750 (at $1.50 each) for 500 coins - especially since the numbers would be randomly generated by the system, and the life of trackable geocoins thus far has been maybe at most 10 hops. (Heck, the life of most of my travel bugs hasn't exceeded 25-50 hops and they last a ton longer for their price!) Which brings me to question c: C) In light of the fact that there is an additional fee from the manufactureror for each coin to be individually carved with the tracking numbers you provide, and that those of us going through a coin service (the coin service does NOT make ANY profit off the numbers they get from you but simply has to pass that cost along) to make the coins, is there any chance of requesting that you review the pricing (now that tracking numbers will be practically required to post on this site) and lower it to something less such as suggested in question B? My major concern here is that I want to keep the coin I want to produce for trade and putting in caches at a reasonable cost. Yes, I would want to sell a few - say the first 10-25 on eBay to help lessen some of the "hit" I took. (I've been selling my extra coins on eBay to try and save money to make my own coin with this specific reason in mind.) Thing is that when I priced it without tracking numbers v/s with tracking numbers, the cost nearly doubled. This really put it out of reach for me to even buy, let alone put it into a cache and make it trackable on your site. (This is why I haven't done it yet - hoping your cost would go down as the coin craze continued to develop.) The alternative I looked into was developing the numbers myself (with a simple excel program then using another service to track them and/or building my own website) but then we go back to the "greek" theory I mentioned above. Finally, question D: D) Can you advise as to what is the average life of travelbugs/geocoins in the wild? Do you have figures like this that you can provide to help show me a value comparison here? I mean $4.75 for a travel bug seems high, but if they're on average out in the wild for say 6-8 months (or like 50 hops even) and GC has done the work to produce everything about them V/S $1.50 extra on top of the $6.00 it's costing us to make and produce the items ourselves for 1-2 hops really doesn't seem like equal value when we've done most of the work on an individual basis. I guess my thought is if the cost were lowered in comparison to the value, maybe we could see more coins in caches as well.... Thanks for whatever responses you can provide. I hope you can applaud my effort to not shoot the messengers delivering the policy change, despite my initial not liking portions of it and wanting to respond with a huge blast. I would like to note that I do understand that this is a business (despite most folks here disagreeing) and you have a right to a profit and to allow/disallow whom you choose to use your site how you choose to do it. On a side note, I will note that competition is part of the American way, so hopefully for the good of all, serious competition will arise in relation to not only this site, but others on the internet as well. Kindest Regards, ~Rose The Grand Experiment: Covering the world in Geocoins.. One Cache at a time.

Hey Sam, I am, but not for too long - I'm basically driving some stuff across the country to put in storage at my family's house, and then flying out to Germany. I have a job transfer for a minimum of 2 years sending me to a little South West of Berlin. ~Rose

Hooray for him! Also, thanks for listening to my whine. Sorry for the hijak above, it was just kind of frustrating/surprising. I can distribute to caches here in Utah if anyone wants to send me a coin, and in the next 2 weeks, I'll be driving from Utah to Georgia, so for those of you wanting to have coins dropped along the freeway, I think we may be able to arrange something like that. ~Rose