infiniteMPG

The WHOLE internet? Cool! Where do I pick it up?

Can we spell T-O-L-E-R-A-N-C-E? The OP is about religious materials in caches and what it boils back to is if it's YOUR cache then dump 'em if you don't want them in there. If it ISN'T you cache then sign the log and move along, not your house to clean. If you find them in a cache and you don't personally think they should be in there then by all means, email the owner and tell them and let THEM do something about it like post "I have been informed there are religious papers in this cache, can the next finder please remove them for me" or let them do it on a maintenance run. Maybe it's from THEIR church and they want them there. I have found several caches on church property with the church's permission and would feel no more offended by their material in there then I would to trail maps in a park cache. I don't think you'll spotaniously combust if you move religious papers aside to find the log book "I used to think anyone doing anything weird was weird. Now I know that it is the people that call others weird that are weird." - Paul McCartney

Naw...... the "Emotional repercussions caused by the decline in the quality of Startrek outfits due to Chinese imports" forum doesn't have any geeks or nerds in it That's easy.... it's 'cause she's the one with the sword

The first TB I sent out had a goal to get from here (Florida) to my cuz in Christchurch, New Zealand. Placed it in a TB motel near TIA (Tampa) and it hopped from there to Colorado, then to Sydney, then to NZ and hand delivered to him. Was one of the things that totally hooked me on GC. Near any international airport would be best and pay attention to the packaging. You're trying to entice someone to snag your TB over the others there so make it eye catching and be sure the mission is clearly listed for anyone at the cache to see. I am sure some people check the inventory before they go to a cache but most people I know work by the "Hey! That's a cool TB!" method

You may notice the strategic use of the term "in most cases" as I know some geocachers of the female persuasion that would leave me in their dust in their quest for the find... and they have But in "most" cases (from what I have seen) the female of the geocaching species tends to let the male wander off the leash as to not get needlessly pulled into the brush themselves.... So then what would a female nerd be? Trying to remember if there were females involves in thje revenge of said nerds

I say to thee to kiss thine pedigreed amphibian and find out if it becomes Prince or Princess Of Groundspeak....

Totally agree as with some teams it's the female of the couple who wears the dominant geocaching pants Paddler Found is actually the one who introduced me to the game, a move I think she sometimes regrets - PF=1 hide, iMPG=+250 hides. I guess a quick answer would be to see if someone could do a breakdown of active geocachers by gender, but I think it's pretty evenly split with the main difference being that in most cases it's the male who takes the bushwhacking, stream wading, palmetto slicing direct path to the cache while the female uses common sense, follows the intended pathway and also bleeds less while signing the log

Was a CUb Scout in Canada and then a Boy Scout with Troop 17 in Burlington, NC, back in the 70's and appreciate the skills and love of outdoors it taught me. My son (now 20) got into the local troop here in Florida but the troop leader was one of his friend's mother and the meetings were more into arts and crafts then survivial skills and camping so he got quickly bored and quit. Wish I could of pitched in but being a single pop and already coaching his soccer team and my daughter's softball my free time was spent. Wish he had a better experience, it really does help.

Shorts are so much cooler to cache with in Florida, you get to do fun things like donate blood to the briars and thorns (been looking like that picture above more times then I can remember to the point of throwing my blood soaked socks out), pick the ticks off, treat poison ivy for weeks on end, get sun burned, saw your legs dang near off running away from wild hogs thru the palmettos, getting sand spurs down the top of your socks, all kinds of 'fun' activities. Okay, occasionally I LISTEN and wear my light hiking pants.... but only occasionally. And that just seems to encourage that direct-line GZ approach from anything less then 300-feet

Each cacher has total ownership and responsibility over their hides, just like owning a house. As long as it's in within the GC guidelines, what is in their hide/house is under their control. Everyone can yammer on about what they think but when it comes down to it, the owner has final word inside their cache. Hopefully not too much of a stretch to see that analogy. We have seen some fliers for something religious in a cache one time and we just pushed them aside along with the busted up McJunk, the rusted up Hotwheels cars, the heat baked White Snake cassette tape, the worn-down-to-the-bare-plastic parade beads, the cracked in half squirt gun, the dry rotted superball, and the several-time-wet-and-now-just-damp-and-moldy fuzzy critter doll and signed the log and left. One cacher's garbage is another cacher's treasure. Best we ran across was certificates in a cache for a nearby pub and a cacher who had a deal to buy a beer for whomever brought in the coupons. If I considered it "ignorant" for someone to leave the next cacher a free beer coupon, well, I'm all for more ignorance then!

Oh so true.... and IMHO the *ONLY* person that should have any control of what items or materials are allowed in any particular hide (within the guidelines of GC) is the owner. Period! You visit someone else's house you have no right to toss the religious statue off the shelf or rip the AC/DC poster down off the wall. If you don't like it, ignore it or leave. Same goes for visiting someone else's cache. If something in someone else's cache isn't profane or obscene yet it offends you, ignore it or leave (or both). Ain't your property.

Forget false logs, what affects us (and affected us) are things like Tropical Storm Fay. We have a friend with a house on the beach on Siesta Key and he sent us some pics of the damage from Tropical Storm Fay yesterday. I think he's ready to sell this place now. I'm glad we live inland. I'd hate to have to look forward to this every time a storm comes through

Come and see the violence inherent in the system. Help! Help! I'm being repressed! Bloody peasant! Oh, what a giveaway! Did you hear that? Did you hear that, eh? That's what I'm on about! Did you see him repressing me? You saw him, Didn't you? By the same perspective a Mayor McCheese McToy in a cache can be seen as "pushing" Micky-D's which could be deemed inappropriate for caching vegetarians. A Goofy character could be seen as "pushing" the commercial and materialist values of Disney World and inappropriate to naturalists. Kind of makes you wonder how pacifists feel popping open ammo cans! This is where tolerance comes into effect.... and also where that extra couple sheets of paper, soggy or not, can be a lot more valuable then plastic toys

Good world, a few bad people. We give credit to the FTF at the bottom of every cache page, kind of the prize for being the FTF. On some caches in the area (and some of ours) that are tough ones, the first so-many people are entered in the listing as people who completed the challenge. We have a tough paddle-only cache that someone got the FTF on, signed the log sheet and forgot to enter it online (was a little disappointing to the STF). Would be nice to allow automatic (but optional) validation from GC on caches without making them mystery/puzzle caches or requiring an email outside of GC.com (a cacher can enter a find even when data is required to be emailed as it's up to the owner to delete the log if the data's not sent, the cacher doesn't have to wait for validation to enter the find). Like a multi-character code in the cache and a place on the log page to enter the code when entering the find. No code entered properly, no find log allowed on the page. And the owner could update the code whenever desired so if the code got distributed then the owner could change it to something else. Then anyone concerned about bogus logging could just turn that feature ON for their caches.... end of story

They were already a "group" so a few more like-minded folks, especially with kids, should be welcomed with open arms. Still nice to ask especially if they give any kind of vibe that they're going to mind. We were in Boca Grande caching on bikes and kept seeing logs writen the same day from some out of state cachers in the area. We rushed a little more to each cache and then when we were winding down, a car with that state's tags pulled over and a lady got out with a GPSr in hand... AHA! We probably spent 1/2 an hour at that cache joking and exchanging stories. Cherish those times.

Are caches (or cachers) in sexual material allowed???? Practice safe caching.

Sharing = A sign in front of the church with letters placed on said sign stating some religious statement about something the church believes. Pass by it on the road, read it or not, your choice. You don't have to pay any attention to it at all, your choice. Pushing = When driving with the windows down you stop at the intersection in front of the church and turn away, caring not to read the sign. A church patron runs up to you window and emphatically starts reciting the sign's message to you directly to your face. When you roll up your window he just starts yelling it and knocks on your window and points to the sign. Intolerance = When you drive by the church you see the sign and immediately call up the local paper and start a petition to have the sign removed so you don't have to even accidentally glance at it and condem your soul to h3ll because you don't believe in their church's beliefs and feel offended somehow because they don't believe the same way you do. If something offends you in a cache but it's because of something you believe or don't believe in and not something obscene or profane, they just sign the log and move along. Kick intolerance to the curb and the world would be a much nicer place. Geocaching would be, too.

This topic has even reared it's ugly head in the local community forums and the last post summed it up nicely.... You say In your opinion, well in My opinion if you can't find anything but ammo cans in the woods then I sugest you vere off of the Osceola Forest. To each his/her own and if you need to reach GZ, shut your eyes and flail around your hiking stick a few seconds until you hear that hollow THUNK of an ammo can to have fun then by all means, filter out the micros. The rest of us will enjoy the whole game. And at last check overtcaching.com was available, too

10 Planks of the Geocaching Manifesto - Abolition of hides except those solely on land dedicated to public purposes. - A progressive or graduated fee for caching. - Abolition of all right of adoption of orphaned caches. - Termination of membership and confiscation of all hides of cheaters and false loggers. - Centralization of control of allowable cache types and container sizes. - Centralization of the means and format for all cache publication. - Improvement of quality of cache hides in accordance with a common plan. - Equal liability to all for personal or property damage incurred while geocaching. - Combination of urban and rural hides; gradual abolition of the distinction between them by a more equable distribution of the hides over the country. - Free education for all cachers Okay, okay... I just re-wrote the text for the communist manifesto but you should get my drift... Nothing is more difficult, and therefore more precious, than to be able to decide. ~Napoleon Bonaparte

Not a poem.... "Kashmir" lyrics And if you play the album backwards you can hear them say "If you hide it, they will come".... and I still stand by that the Groundspeak logo looks like a cross being blown by the wind.... HOW OFFENSIVE!!! (PUH-lease) Hell's Bells, another gewd album!

Oh let the sun beat down upon my face, stars to fill my dreamI am a traveler of both time and space, to be where I have been To sit with elders of the gentle race, this world has seldom seen They talk of days for which they sit and wait and all will be revealed

Each cache is it's own unique combination of scenery, size, camo, challenge, access and creativity and no "blanket" rules apply. Many people argue that at the end of a ten mile hike in the woods nothing but a full sized, fully stocked ammo can is acceptable. In many people's opinions (including mine) the larger containers are for swag which I know some people enjoy but is more of a draw for kids. How many kids are going to hike the ten miles? I'd rather people carry gear, snacks, and drinks in their packs then a big bag of McJunk to trade. A lamp post cache is looked at as "lame" by many people but how is that any more or less "lame" then an ammo can plopped under the one lone tree down a wooded trail? Both require minimal effort to find when you reach GZ. Some people don't like to hike just like some people don't like PAG's. If you require someone to paddle or hike a good part of a day to reach some place, you might not want to bust their chops giving them a near impossible camo job. If you put something somewhere easy to access, you can still challenge someone with tricky camo. A balanced GC life is the best and to please the majority of the people the majority of the time, there needs to be the most possible options to let pick from. IMHO it boils down to the basics of challenge, creativity, originality, imagination and fun and the proper size container for a hide is in the eye of the cache-owner. One cacher's lame is another cacher's treasure.

On the subject of "dude" being disrespectful or not, the "head dude" (president) of our company held a meeting with all of engineering yesterday and while he was trying to make a very serious point his cell phone rang LOUD and his ring tone was Led Zepplin's "Kashmir" off of "Physical Grafitti" and we all looked around waiting for someone to say "d-u-d-e" to him.... hehehehe Cool dude! Duck Season!

For a long time I had as many hides as finds as because I have as much, if not more, fun hiding a cache (and reading the fun logs) as finding them. I have seen people who have hid 1 or 2 hides and they're great hides. I have seen people with many, many hides without much creativity. I agree you learn as you go, but people's hides are generally a reflection of their creativity and imagination. I enjoy logs from vacationing cachers stating they're taking an idea back home to use... especially the wicked evil ones But I think things work well the way they are. No need to rock the boat. And a cache rating system that a cacher can fill out on the cache page when they log a find would help owners keep up with what the general caching public likes and dislikes.... Ooops, did I say that..... again? Shhhhhhhhhhhh

President of my company (large manufacturing firm) was in a restaurant where I was seated at the bar playing trivia and in the conversation bosses were brought up. I was asked "Where's your boss?" and answered "He's that dude in the booth with his family". No disrespect at all. In fact we chatted later and he bought me a beer. Cool dude and being able to chat with the 'regular folks' is important to him. Seems a lot of this issue is more about tolerance then belief, more about sensitivity then politcal or religious correctness. Just like the religious cartoons causing riots and turmoil... it's not strong convictions that caused that, it's intolerance. And that intolerance is a cancer to society because with that type of intolerance the only society that can exist is one where all believe the same. Of course there are reasonable 'limits' to tolerance. It's one thing to attack someone attempting to burn an American flag, but it's another if you punch someone out because they just blew their nose in a red, white and blue handkerchief. For the OP if there is something religious in a cache and it's against your beliefs, leave it and move on. Might be right in line with the next cacher's beliefs. Unless you're the owner and you're against it, or unless it's extremely offensive to the general public or if there's like hundreds of them in one cache, then removing it or destroying it would just show intolerance. And yes, there are many different personal inpretations to "offensive" but I think everyone will agree there is a general "social standard" that wouldn't be too hard to define. No one's forcing anyone to read it. I don't mind static religious informational offerrings like that, wouldn't read it but wouldn't bother me. Now if someone were standing beside the cache preaching their beliefs in my face as I was signing the log, that would be a different story. So unless GC determines that's "soliciting" then leave it be. The skin of the people have grown oh so thin.... ever notice how the Groundspeak logo looks a little like a cross? Better watch out for the correctness folks...