Zuckerruebensirup

quote:Originally posted by inceptor: As to a fight? Nah, too old to go 12 rounds with anyone any more. Nah, we're never too old for fighting...especially in the virtual world.

quote:Originally posted by Alan2: Maybe I'm missing something, but why would you take a chance on getting screwed for a 2 1/2% savings? And what happens if you have a problem with the unit afterwards? What dealer are you going to return it to or ask for consideration? I've bought new things through eBay (digital camera and PDA), and have been very happy. With the camera package, I was missing an adapter tube (required to use the zoom lenses that were included in the package...the auction didn't specifically say it was included; but it seemed to me, if they sell a "package" deal, you ought to be able to use it as delivered, without having to purchase additional components). I called the dealer I purchased it from, and they were very nice, and promptly shipped out the part at no cost to me. With the PDA, I ended up having an intermittent connection problem with the USB cradle. I contacted the manufacturer, who promptly sent out a replacement, and told me to keep the original. ------- Join us at our first "geo-gathering" on 4/27/02!

Wow, I'm surprised that, out of over 180 views, only three people have asked permission to place a cache, or had one of their caches discovered. I would have thought there would be a higher percentage than that. ------- Join us at our first "geo-gathering" on 4/27/02!

quote: Originally posted by sbell111: I realize that, in most cases, the earth will repair herself of whatever minor damage we do. However, we must understand, that we must play by the guidelines implemented by the land managers. quote:Originally posted by inceptor: How often does the earth repair herself? Has the rain forest in South America grown back already? Have many of the small forests and large groves of trees that have been destroyed are grown back? How long does it take for the lakes, rivers and creeks to clean themselves so that the water is clean again? Umm, I think you missed the word "minor" up there. I hardly think the destruction of the rain forest falls under the minor category. I think sbell was refering to things like footpaths worn into the grass due to traffic to a cache. Anyway, he was advocating that we respect the park and land management rules. Unless I miss my mark, it appears that you're trying to pick an argument with someone whose views are not in opposition to your own. ------- Join us at our first "geo-gathering" on 4/27/02!

When you say "not Michigan" I'm assuming you're refering to the location of the get-together, rather than who's invited. Because I happen to be only a couple hours from Fort Wayne (either of them actually)...and if Michiganders are welcome, I'd be interested in coming (depending on when you plan it, and what other commitments I have, of course). ------- Join us at our first "geo-gathering" on 4/27/02!

When you say "not Michigan" I'm assuming you're refering to the location of the get-together, rather than who's invited. Because I happen to be only a couple hours from Fort Wayne (either of them actually)...and if Michiganders are welcome, I'd be interested in coming (depending on when you plan it, and what other commitments I have, of course). ------- Join us at our first "geo-gathering" on 4/27/02!

quote:Originally posted by smoochnme: I think we can agree that parks and the programs they provide have multiple goals. Yes, I think that’s very true. quote: I also agree that if a state park or forest does nothing else, the land preserved for the public trust is worth their existance. […] Most parks and forest people are good land stewards and know how much visitation they can sustain before some of their other goals may be negatively affected. Good point. I think it’s basically a case by case issue of whether they feel attracting more visitors would be a good or bad thing. The bottom line, though (getting back to the original topic of this thread), is that whether or not more visitors are sought out…that if we want to encourage park authorities to allow (if not enthusiastically welcome) Geocaching in their parks, we need to exercise care and common sense about where and how we place them. quote:Around here, state parks and forest just don't seem to feel as if there are too many visitors. Thus, they are always looking for more and try hard to maintain the level of visitors they currently have. Maybe their budget is based on visitation? I truly don't know. Ouch, that's another can of worms. Ah, yes…a topic worth an entire debate of its own. [This message was edited by Zuckerruebensirup on April 25, 2002 at 10:54 AM.]

quote:Originally posted by smoochnme: I think we can agree that parks and the programs they provide have multiple goals. Yes, I think that’s very true. quote: I also agree that if a state park or forest does nothing else, the land preserved for the public trust is worth their existance. […] Most parks and forest people are good land stewards and know how much visitation they can sustain before some of their other goals may be negatively affected. Good point. I think it’s basically a case by case issue of whether they feel attracting more visitors would be a good or bad thing. The bottom line, though (getting back to the original topic of this thread), is that whether or not more visitors are sought out…that if we want to encourage park authorities to allow (if not enthusiastically welcome) Geocaching in their parks, we need to exercise care and common sense about where and how we place them. quote:Around here, state parks and forest just don't seem to feel as if there are too many visitors. Thus, they are always looking for more and try hard to maintain the level of visitors they currently have. Maybe their budget is based on visitation? I truly don't know. Ouch, that's another can of worms. Ah, yes…a topic worth an entire debate of its own. [This message was edited by Zuckerruebensirup on April 25, 2002 at 10:54 AM.]

I recently relocated a couple of my caches due to vulernability to exposure. In both cases, they were moved to new hiding spots within the same park they had originally been placed in. For one of them, I felt that the new hiding place involved enough new scenery and different hike from the previous location, that I encouraged previous finders to come back and log a new find. On the other, I left the first leg of the multi-cache relatively the same, and then moved the cache box to a slightly different hiding place than its original one. I didn't feel that a new visit would feel a whole lot different than before the cache was updated, so I didn't do anything to flag the cache as having moved (other than to put a note in the log, saying that the cache was secure again, after it had previously been exposed). ------- Join us at our first "geo-gathering" on 4/27/02!

quote:by smoochnme: Is it not important for parks to attract visitors? quote:by Zuckerruebensirup: No, I'm not under the impression that there is a need to attract visitors. Have you ever tried to get reservations for campsites? In the more popular places, they can be tough to get. I think the reason for the park services is to help control visitation, so that there is as little impact/damage as possible. They want to keep these natural areas from being destroyed, so that we, and our children, (and the resident wildlife, of course) can enjoy them for as long as possible. quote:by smoochnme: If they are not attracting visitors then what the heck are they (the parks) there for? I'm not referring to "protected areas"! They are a different issue and should be avoided by geocachers. State Parks and Forest in my state actually do use counts and report park usage. State Park programming is actually geared toward attracting the public to the park. Maybe it is different in other areas. I was under the impression that the parks are there in order to preserve a portion of our natural areas from becoming developed, thus saving some space for the wildlife, while also allowing visitors to get away from the city and enjoy a bit of nature. I didn't say that the parks AREN'T attracting visitors, but that I don't think they have a "need" to do so. Plenty of people already seem to be attracted without any additional campaigns required. Our parks have programs for people to participate in, too...but I didn't think the purpose was to "attract" people who wouldn't otherwise come, but rather to make the visit enjoyable for those who do come. I'm not aware of any local parks that are sitting around nearly vacant, while the park services are trying to drum up visitation. Perhaps it's different in your state. If so, then I'd expect that they'd be very receptive to the suggestion of bringing in Geocaches.

quote:by smoochnme: Is it not important for parks to attract visitors? quote:by Zuckerruebensirup: No, I'm not under the impression that there is a need to attract visitors. Have you ever tried to get reservations for campsites? In the more popular places, they can be tough to get. I think the reason for the park services is to help control visitation, so that there is as little impact/damage as possible. They want to keep these natural areas from being destroyed, so that we, and our children, (and the resident wildlife, of course) can enjoy them for as long as possible. quote:by smoochnme: If they are not attracting visitors then what the heck are they (the parks) there for? I'm not referring to "protected areas"! They are a different issue and should be avoided by geocachers. State Parks and Forest in my state actually do use counts and report park usage. State Park programming is actually geared toward attracting the public to the park. Maybe it is different in other areas. I was under the impression that the parks are there in order to preserve a portion of our natural areas from becoming developed, thus saving some space for the wildlife, while also allowing visitors to get away from the city and enjoy a bit of nature. I didn't say that the parks AREN'T attracting visitors, but that I don't think they have a "need" to do so. Plenty of people already seem to be attracted without any additional campaigns required. Our parks have programs for people to participate in, too...but I didn't think the purpose was to "attract" people who wouldn't otherwise come, but rather to make the visit enjoyable for those who do come. I'm not aware of any local parks that are sitting around nearly vacant, while the park services are trying to drum up visitation. Perhaps it's different in your state. If so, then I'd expect that they'd be very receptive to the suggestion of bringing in Geocaches.

Standard household scissors worked for me. ------- Join us at our first "geo-gathering" on 4/27/02!

Standard household scissors worked for me. ------- Join us at our first "geo-gathering" on 4/27/02!

quote:Originally posted by magellan315: So long as the list does not get junked up with caches were you supply a picture of a dalmation or a red car. Hey, where do I find that Dalmation cache? ------- Join us at our first "geo-gathering" on 4/27/02!

quote:Originally posted by magellan315: So long as the list does not get junked up with caches were you supply a picture of a dalmation or a red car. Hey, where do I find that Dalmation cache? ------- Join us at our first "geo-gathering" on 4/27/02!

quote:Originally posted by Jeremy808: Is there a forum for geocaching in the Gulf of Mexico? I’m not very good with my geography, but I assume it would either be in either the West and Southwest or Mexico forums. ------- Join us at our first "geo-gathering" on 4/27/02!

quote:Originally posted by Jeremy808: Is there a forum for geocaching in the Gulf of Mexico? I’m not very good with my geography, but I assume it would either be in either the West and Southwest or Mexico forums. ------- Join us at our first "geo-gathering" on 4/27/02!

quote:Originally posted by Parsa: Many GPS recievers look quite a bit like cell phones. In a crowded area I can sort of look around in a bored fashion while I hold my "cell phone" and press buttons. When I find the general cache area, I have to begin searching, so I just hold the reciever to my ear and give an occaisional "uh huh" or something of the kind. Most people are going to ignore someone on a cell phone, and most people also want to give you some privacy during your "call." I've used the 'cell phone' thing, too. But since I've been carrying a camera around my neck, I've resorted to the photographer's demeanor. I like the clipboard idea for urban areas, though. I'll have to remember that one. (Assuming I ever make it to an urban area, that is.) ------- Join us at our first "geo-gathering" on 4/27/02!

quote:Originally posted by Parsa: Many GPS recievers look quite a bit like cell phones. In a crowded area I can sort of look around in a bored fashion while I hold my "cell phone" and press buttons. When I find the general cache area, I have to begin searching, so I just hold the reciever to my ear and give an occaisional "uh huh" or something of the kind. Most people are going to ignore someone on a cell phone, and most people also want to give you some privacy during your "call." I've used the 'cell phone' thing, too. But since I've been carrying a camera around my neck, I've resorted to the photographer's demeanor. I like the clipboard idea for urban areas, though. I'll have to remember that one. (Assuming I ever make it to an urban area, that is.) ------- Join us at our first "geo-gathering" on 4/27/02!

Locationless caches get their own category. Plus, I saw at least one link to a locationless cache that hadn't been mentioned here before. ------- Join us at our first "geo-gathering" on 4/27/02!

Locationless caches get their own category. Plus, I saw at least one link to a locationless cache that hadn't been mentioned here before. ------- Join us at our first "geo-gathering" on 4/27/02!

quote:Originally posted by BrianSnat: Place your cache where it will have limited impact, even if the impact is a simply a perceived one. [...] I moved the cache because there was the perception that it had an impact. Kudos to you, Brian! This is a perfect example of the point I was trying to make on this thread, where people were discussing (rather heatedly) whether drilling holes in an already dead tree was a big deal. We need to always consider how our actions will be perceived (even if that perception is incorrect), and how others will react to the example we set. Especially in a virtual community (where we can't always see things first hand for ourselves, but have to depend upon our interpretation of the words of others), it's easy for misunderstandings to take place...and they can have a snowballing effect. ------- Join us at our first "geo-gathering" on 4/27/02!

quote:Originally posted by BrianSnat: Place your cache where it will have limited impact, even if the impact is a simply a perceived one. [...] I moved the cache because there was the perception that it had an impact. Kudos to you, Brian! This is a perfect example of the point I was trying to make on this thread, where people were discussing (rather heatedly) whether drilling holes in an already dead tree was a big deal. We need to always consider how our actions will be perceived (even if that perception is incorrect), and how others will react to the example we set. Especially in a virtual community (where we can't always see things first hand for ourselves, but have to depend upon our interpretation of the words of others), it's easy for misunderstandings to take place...and they can have a snowballing effect. ------- Join us at our first "geo-gathering" on 4/27/02!

quote:Originally posted by yrium: Sounds hokey, but I'd recommend everyone focus on the whole start to end trek - to and from the cache - instead of the last five minutes of the search. I'm not so focused on the GPS arrow anymore and it makes geocaching better. Doesn't sound hokey at all! In fact, it's a perfect example of enjoying the journey, instead of just the destination. ------- Join us at our first "geo-gathering" on 4/27/02!

quote:Originally posted by yrium: Sounds hokey, but I'd recommend everyone focus on the whole start to end trek - to and from the cache - instead of the last five minutes of the search. I'm not so focused on the GPS arrow anymore and it makes geocaching better. Doesn't sound hokey at all! In fact, it's a perfect example of enjoying the journey, instead of just the destination. ------- Join us at our first "geo-gathering" on 4/27/02!