G & C

Thanks for the cointest! This one was taken at GC2MWMM The Fire from Within:

They are? I wasn't aware of that. It was my understanding that folks were bothered by the scars, which, according to at least one local, may last for decades, that's true. But the thing that got them "worked up", as you so eloquently put it, was the contempt and disdain expressed by the anti-environment crowd, due to their belief that such public displays could cause us, (the collective us), grief in the future. Lemme check... <still checking> <Still checking> Yup! I was right. In this thread, what has folks "worked up" is the attitudes. The scars are secondary. Perhaps we are reading two different threads? [whisper]Pssst... Clan Riffster... psssst... Read the title of the thread. Then try again at what this thread is about.[/whisper] Barely noticeable, eh? They are clearly distinguishable from a gazillion miles up. OK, that's an exaggeration. On my monitor, using Google Earth, the tracks are only clearly distinguishable at 47,055' or lower, or roughly 8.9 miles. I think commercial aviation flies at around 33,000' in that neck of the woods. Perhaps a pilot could verify that? If so, these scars could be seen by passengers of the average 747 flying overhead. Perhaps we have different definitions of "barely"? Personally, I wouldn't call anything which is clearly visible from almost 9 miles up "barely noticeable". But that's just me... and a few other environmentally conscious folks. As a pilot, I indeed can confirm that 33,000' would be a fairly common altitude to fly a commercial jet at. But apparently our "clearly distinguishable" is set at different levels. You do know those cute green lines connecting the dots in the OPs photo aren't what's visible from FL330, right?

Dude. You don't care about the environment. We get that. For the most part, we are OK with it, as we've learned that the kind of person who believes trashing Momma Nature is OK is never, ever going to change. (Sort of an "accept the things you cannot change" kinda thing) Being able to see the world from your perspective is beneficial to us. What I would ask, before you make such ridiculous statements like the one above, is that, for just 5 seconds, you try to see through the eyes of those who do care about the environment. When I hear about an ecological disaster, or even some mild ecological concern, it upsets me regardless of what geographic region it occurs in. Perhaps some day I could be so callous as to shrug off something like the Exxon Valdez spill, because it didn't mess up my beaches, but I doubt it. Those who care about the environment believe that we all share this planet. I care about the environment. Especially the desert. I'm a child of the desert. Born and raised. Spent much of my childhood cleaning up after other people because it was, after all, just the desert. My backyard was treated like the city folks' dumping ground frequently. Also watched as off roaders drove their 4X4s over intaglios that are believed to be thousands of years old, leaving tire marks all over them before the state finally fenced them off. But this is a little ridiculous even in my eyes. Folks are getting worked up over a trail being left. One that's barely noticeable at that. If you're going to get mad about an area that people are driving over, get angry and contact the government about the giant highway that runs through the area a mile away from the alien head. THAT is leaving a mark on the environment. Walk, bike, quad, drive, and it will all leave a trail in time. But the bottom line is that there is no consequence to this more than a barely visible mark being left, of which there are thousands like it within a mile of the same alien head.

Do any of you actually know what that land is used for? Grazing cattle. It's such a fragile environmental area that they allow huge herds of grazing cattle to roam, stampede, eat, poop, and sometimes even wander the roads to cause huge car accidents. The impact of what is going on out there is SO minimal, and is being SO exaggerated in this thread, it's not even funny. I've been there. Recently. Those trails are not so visible from the ground, and if it weren't for the lines being drawn on the OPs little chart there, I wouldn't be able to see it there. But everybody needs something to whine about. Further, I was also at the event in August in Rachel. The COs were VERY clear about it not being ok to drive to the caches in the alien head and/or space ship shape series. But y'all should keep this conversation going. The lines are pretty clearly drawn, and this is way more of a debate about power trails than it is the ecological sanctity of the area in question. You're not really fooling anyone.

I don't mess with a trackables history for this very reason. Its history is its history. Just because you bought the coin, doesn't mean that the person who logged the discovery didn't discover the coin anymore. To take the credit away from them for doing so is pretty lame, IMNSHO. You can't change the miles on that used car you just bought, or who your spouse was with before you by deleting their logs... it's all a part of history. Y'all should think about not trying to change history.

I basically do the same thing you're doing. I also post all of my pics on my coins page. TB31QV7 G&C's Coin

You've got mail! Joined: 11-1-11 Name recieved: Card Sent: Card recieved:

Agreed!

I've wanted to do one, trackable, for a while now. It's money that keeps me from it, and that's about it.

It's a win-win. Maxpedition makes incredible gear. I'm a big fan of the Condor-II. It's a decent sized pack, but the compression straps make it really easy to condense the thing down to whatever size you need it to be for short hikes.

What they said. Mine have my geocaching name, the date of the find, and where the find was (all of the GC titles have been too long!).

+1 I love my Mechanix gloves. Another vote for the Mechanix gloves. I love mine. I use a pair for climbing/rappelling, a pair for yard work, a pair for hunting, and a pair for caching in the bushes. I don't know of many reasonable pairs of gloves that will save you from a snake bite, but spiders and bushes won't be a problem anymore. Here's the pair that I use:

Wrong. This is a very good comparison. Necessity or not, there is nothing in the United States Constitution guaranteeing me the right to a car. There is, however, the guarantee of my right to bear arms. We could go into necessity, but we'd go on for a very long time.

All semantics and details aside, the shooter is screwed. First, he's in CA. There couldn't be a worse place for you to be a gun owner, except maybe New Jersey. Second, the people were retreating. That's a basic no-no in ANY city, state, whatever, often even if they ARE armed. I'm a big advocate for gun ownership. People deserve the right to protect themselves, as the police and the government have no legal obligation to do it for them. But with privilege comes great responsibility, and if you're not up for exercising the responsibility part, you'd best not exercise the privilege part. Or stuff like this happens, and you wind up in jail, deservedly.

The difference is how easy you make it for people to get a gun. Make it harder, and fewer people will have guns. Fewer people with guns means a lower chance to get shot at while geocaching (or whatever other activity). It's a simple equation really. Sure, if simple = stupid. Your equation works in criminals favor. That's the simplicity in it. Make it harder for law abiding citizens to own guns, and the criminals will have all the guns. Don't try to punish the normal folks for the actions of a moron.

Not to question the reviewers integrity, but I would be a little skeptical to hide something of any real value meant for a cacher to have to find, and let them have access to the actual location...

Do you have any idea concerning my opinion about car TBs or are you just kinda throwing it out there to make your point? I am simply a responder to your statement about proxy TBs. Got some interesting thoughts on car TBs that might intrigue me?

REI carries them, but you're gonna pay through the nose. I get mine from the local military surplus store. Mine has them for as cheap as $1 a piece for not so good ones, to about $3-4 a piece for the bigger, really nice ones.

That is NOT true. Oh really. When was the first proxy bug that was a problem for you. Odd. It would appear as though my car is a proxy TB. It has a TB tracking number on it. Gives the TB icon to anyone who discovers it. Yet... it is NOT a TB. Therefore, it must be a proxy TB. I've seen several of these. Not one has been thrown away when found that I've heard of.

Snakes scare the bejeesus out of me. Rattlers top that list. Been around them all of my life, and just never got the fear out of me. I see a handful of snakes a year, but I've never encountered a rattler while caching. My buddy CraigsOutside, on the other hand, has been bit on the hand while caching. Interesting stuff.

Love my 550t, wouldn't trade it for anything. Had the opportunity to turn it in for a Montana, and turned it down. It's a great GPS, does everything I could ever need it to do and more. The camera is a feature that I am unwilling to trade. If I have my GPS on me, I have a camera on me, no questions asked. No more "I forgot the camera at home/in the car/wherever." It's on me everywhere I go. I've taken some pretty darned nice photos with it, too.

Same issue here, tried installing just a little while ago. I'm bummed, because Wherigo Builder is not treating me very nicely...

Huh. Glad to hear I'm not the only one. Also glad I checked here. I got the same message about five minutes ago.

Sounds like it would be no different from a night time only cache. Except that night time comes a bit more often than the rains and T-storms do. I say go for it if you can figure it out.

So far, we see the military (and private sector GPS users) showing concern. While I'm sure the telecom sector is concerned, last I checked the military doesn't have a horse in that race. What? What's being suggested is not that they are taking money, but that they are using their money to influence the gov'ts decisions. Yeah, it's a strawman argument meant to divert attention. But did anyone actually expect them to say "Yes of COURSE we bought your president (what parts of him were not already sold seven times over,)" twirls mustache, "And there's nothing you can do about it, because we bought the Senate and the Supreme Court too. It was 'buy 2 get 1 free'." Of course you also have to remember where Obama is coming from. He represents a party and a section of a party that has an ingrained instinct level distrust and disregard for the military, and anything else that smells of tradition, discipline, personal responsibility, and individual sacrifice. Wow. Well said. Would have been true with just about any politicians name inserted in there, but well said.