Sol seaker

Thanks for taking those and posting them Shaddow!! I for one have a morbid curiosity about all this, so that helps. And people think we trash the woods looking for geocaches.

I know people in a few different states who know I hike alone. I kept waiting to hear from them but never did. Maybe I'll ask if they heard, but I hate to give them fuel to freak out on the next time they hear of my hikes.

I really didn't mean to be taken seriously with my question. I only meant to inspire bra jokes; I guess I spend too much time in off topic. sorry. I never heard about this getting national coverage. It sure made me think twice last time I hiked alone in a creepy area though. I've increased my efforts to find people to hike with. Even considered creating an easier alternate to the HOTM.

The police were worried about booby traps, but they said they didn't find any. I don't think this guy was sophisticated enough for that. It seems he thought no one would find him based upon location alone. He wouldn't have openly been cutting wood etc if he thought anyone would find the location. Why do they call it a booby trap anyway??

Thanks, it was a fun and exciting adventure. I have to say that geocaching helped a lot. No cache hide and probably won't divulge the exact location to anyone, I see no value in it. And probably not the general location until the undergrowth fills back in. The value would be to satisfy our curiosity. But what would be the harm in it?

Wow. Congratulations on that FTF. That was a tough one. Everyone else has it easy with coordinates and all. No cache hide?

My ex and I had separate accounts, then decided we wanted to log our shared finds together. We created a third account for that. I had one cache owner get mad at me because "the find counts" on her cache were not accurate for us to log three times between the two of us. The thing is, find counts are never accurate because so many people only have one account for two people, or a family. I don't see it as a big deal myself. I don't care how people log my caches. I don't see the number of finds as a badge of honor so much as a result of the location. If it's a remote cache, it will not get many finds. If it's in a public place, it will get a lot. The counts don't mean any more than that. Creating another account for your wife, or dog, or goldfish for that matter, if you want to carry him around with you as you cache, is not a sock-puppet account. An account is considered an illegal sock-puppet account if it is created only with the intent of hiding your identity from others on the forums. Ps. Groundspeak didn't mind the third account between the two of us, because that was an extra PM membership it got out of us. That account was never used on the forums (that I can remember).

Winner!! The butler will give you your envelope on the way out. Thanks Knowschad!! DEfinitely the winning post!!! And, since you asked so nicely I'll be happy to keep count of those who didn't post here. Uh... how about those who liked the thread but didn't post? Maybe they couldn't come up with anything to say.

I don't understand this post. How can you object to the location if you haven't found it? If you haven't found it you don't know what the location is. Posting a find does not mean you approve of the location, so what difference is it if someone posts a find or not? So do you mean that if I show up at a cache and find it, I'm not supposed to post a find if I don't like the location? This is ludicrous. If that were the case few people would ever log lamp post hides I guess. So what do I do if I half approve of the cache?

Wow. What a mess. Yeah, needs a CITO and some plants planted. Wad it hard to find?

I'd say "no." If the owner is not going to maintain the cache, then it shouldn't be there. Let it go. If the cache is by a new cacher I might email them and "remind" them to disable the cache. I'd ask if they know how. Some don't know how. If It's a long-time cacher,I would probably email the local reviewer and give them the story, and let them know the cache is not there, the owner knows it, and has not disabled the listing. After that point it would be out of your hands, and in good hands. Then you don't have to stay up nights worrying about it. So you currently have the logbook and scattered swag in your posession? If that is the case, I tend to think you should have left it at the site I agree. What I've done (when it was convenient for me i.e. a local cache) is: Posted the NM (if NMs haven't already been posted) Then the NA Waited until the cache is archived Cleaned up the cache site Post a note to say the cache remains have been cleared away The only reason I did take this stuff was mainly to save the log. There was no way to keep it waterproofed and I didnt want to have it destroyed. Maybe I will throw it all in a ziplock back and get it back to the location. Seems a waste of an old logbook then. I'd see if the old owner wants the logbook back. I would not leave it at the site without a container. Around here, with the rain, it would make a mushy mess in no time. The cache needs maintenance. Post a "needs maintenance". If you want, put a watch on it, and if it has not been disabled or repaired within a month post a "needs archiving." That will let someone put one there who will maintain it.

I see people who are interested in quality coming out more and more. Being able to put favorite points on a cache has helped a lot. People in the past would often place caches for the numbers as well as find them for the numbers. Lately I've seen more people saying they won't place a cache that won't get favorite points. But there will always be those who cache by numbers.

You would want to have the,caches preloaded. Don't expect them to do that right off. Having laminated maps are a good idea. I don't know if those units have maps, but you have to let them learn in small bites. Some can do more, but most will have more fun if you keep it simple for them. I would just plan on them using the compass on the GPS and nothing else. Frustration is not fun.

I've never understood the concept that distance from home affects whether or not to count something as a find. If I found and signed a cache that I did not know was a throw down, I would not delete it later. If someone put a throw down at one of my caches, I would only delete the log of the one who did the throw down. I really can't blame those that find a throw down. Unless of course the throw down is very obvious as to what it is. Fortunately I've not run across this problem yet in my area. But I think as a cache owner, if someone replaced one of mine, I'd delete their log, aa well as anyone that found the fake cache. I don't look at it as "blaming" those that found the fake, they just didn't find the real cache. I want them to find MY cache. I have to agree. Someone replaced it just because they couldn't find it and didn't have permission to do so. I'd delete their find (I would assume it was the first name on the log sheet) then use their container for a hide somewhere else.

I agree on the limits. Since the phone apps have come out we see a lot of these too. And caches hidden with phones can be 100 feet off. The 101 classes are a great idea. The problem is how to let these new cachers know about them. They don't often read the forums, they don't seem to comb the weekly newsletter like I do. They don't search for events. How do we reach them?

I think the best idea is to renew your membership. 30 bucks is well worth it. If for nothing else, you see the value in loading pocket queries. Like someone said, you want to keep recent queries n your GPS. I keep local queries running once a week and reload. Once I didn't reload, and was in part of town I rarely get to and drove right by a new cache and didn't know it. I also keep them fresh to have recent logs. Yesterday I couldn't find one and found the last person couldn't either. I also saw others found it easily. I walked away and didn't waste more time. There are a lot of reasons to have fresh queries in your GPS. Just renew your membership. Problem solved.

There's some dog themes caches around here. I found one just after it had been restocked. It was full of really nice large dog toys. There's another that has a machine 10 feet from the cache, that releases a scent so the dog can find the cache. Creative.

Nope. I found waypoint one, but it was long ago, before they had the place for notes on the cache page. I no longer have those coords. Sounds like a Squak assault!! (I wonder why it was named Squak anyway?)

So suppose nobody replaces the cache with a new listing? There are areas where this happens - how is that a good outcome? I'm not trying to argue for the practice of throwdowns, and in populous areas, I think good spots barely get cold after being archived before a new cache is listed. But in remote areas with few cachers, you could well end up -1 cache, and that's the end of it. How is that a better outcome? Well, in this case two people were going to replace the caches. Sol seaker did explain how they themselves do not own many listings (apparently only 2 before adding 2 to this trail recently), and they looked at it as a way to give back. But they could have easily been new listings. I can see where you're coming from though, in this special case, and only this special case, of mass cache theft. If the container isn't replaced, and no one else opts to place a cache there, it can give the appearance of the cache thief winning. In the end though, it's just a cache. We got up to 1.8 million active listings and near exponential growth in 12 years despite a few cache thieves. EDIT: And thinking about it even more, I could definitely be persuaded to soften or even change my opinion in the case of mass cache thefts. Anyone else have an opinion? The two replacers could have replaced the caches without claiming finds for something they put there themselves. Or "enjoyed the trail" by just going for a hike along it. Yeah, I knew someone would go ballistic over it. (actually you didn't go ballistic) I wondered my sanity in posting it. I really expected more fireworks really. If these forums have one thing, they have great fireworks. Anyway, I think it would be better to wait for DNF's in most situations too. I'd rather see them replaced or archived by their owners. the problem is that in this case because of the remote locations of these caches, to get enough DNF's to disable, then to wait for replacement or archival would have taken at least two years at the rate it was happening. I mean I guess I could have hiked up there every week for a while and DNFed it every week, but they really need to hear it from more than me. People weren't hiking up there because these were gone, so there was no one to DNF them. We all know a great percentage of the people who DNF, don't log it. So with that, these were getting one DNF every six months or so, and that on only some of them. So, do we just sit and wait for at least two years for a great area to be returned after some cache maggot sets out to ruin our fun? Who knows? Maybe it would have been three before even half were dealt with. I decided not to wait. I chose to be proactive. The cache owners agreed. Everyone wouldn't agree. Heaven knows, there's really nothing that everyone in these forums agree on. Most of the local community is happy to be caching again. After all, that's what the game's about. We're here to cache. So let's play.

if you ever want company for Squak Mountain, specifically getting GC4B3 Tie Mill, I would join you happily. I found it three years ago but would be happy to join a group for the hike. Sounds great!! I'm In. I don't know what that cache entails, but sounds like fun.

No one ever thinks about Squak, and a lot don't even know about it. Squak has some creepy vibes too, in places. Perhaps I'll stay on the trail there.

Interesting thought though. cougar is well populated, but people stay on the trail more because of the danger of mine collapse. Squak would be good because there are fewer trails and fewer people.

Jesandtodd, what trail were you on when you had the encounter with that guy? It's good for us to know. Did you report it to the police?

This isn't the thread for discussing freedom of the press, vs the press slanting what they say, nor discussing who really has control over it. I'll just say, if you think you're hearing everything, then take a look at what's not granted through the "freedom of information act". Or take a look at the press overseas and see what a different take they have on things than we do, even when reporting the same issues. Or try listening to a far right media then a far left media. Wow. Mega difference. Anyway, to get back on topic, It does bother me to know there are more of these guys out there, but if I haven't run into any before now, I'm not likely to in the future. I find this very interesting too, and I don't know why. Perhaps just because it's so different it's curious, I don't know. What would make someone be so nuts like that? Perhaps some of it is the allure of a secret hiding place in the woods. Perhaps just the fact that this has been going on under our noses for so long while we have had no idea. Funny, in a way that is like caching. Many people find out this has been going on under their noses for so long. No, it's different. Lightening Jeff, Yes, I think you're right on with your location. I was pretty amazed to see the map from the press and yours. They are really close if not right on. I'll take your coords with me and let you know. I'm pretty impressed you got it so close. I was not even thinking in that area.

I said before, "if anything" the map is off a little, indicating I felt it was in that general area. It may well be accurate, but officials sensor the press all the time. I don't know why they would here though. It's not like its a top secret installation or anything.