magellan315

It isn't about being "up front"...it's about respecting someones request not to be named or quoted. When you reference e-mails between you and a ranger at the ABDSP about the damage Geocaches have created. If you can't quote the information, even if you withhold the name, than all you are stating is your interpretation. Not verifiable facts.

What was question. What was the answer? You should have no problem providing this. It didn't really pertain directly to the discussion...it was more regarding whether there were "unlisted" geocaches similar to letterboxing. They thought letterboxes were automatically listed here also due to the hybrid type listing. At least you were upfront enough to provide us this. This question does concern me, its clear the ABDSP had a perception about GC.com being responsible for letter boxes. Which makes me ask what other misinformed perceptions do they have about Geocaching that lead them to this ban and if any of them are valid. Its unfortunate they didn't talk to local Geocachers first and getting their facts right. Now they are hiding behind vauge statements about environmental damage that may have occured due to their failure to investigate until after the descison

I for one would love to hear from another perspective on this situation, from the ABDSP staff. Not a Geocacher who no familiarity with the ABDSP. Your friend the ranger has given you information that you feel shows that Geocachers have been responsible for these vague claims of environmental damage. But because you cannot reveal it we can only take your word at it, just like we are supposed to take the word of the ABDSP. This about respecting the ABDSP and verifying their claims. Now you tell us you answered a question for a friend of the ABDSP staff who is monitoring this thread. Given your belief that the ABDSP is right about this matter I concerned how you may have affected the negotiations that are occurring at the local level. The intensity of this thread is proportional to the usefulness of this thread. Your telling us the ABDSP is right in their actions, but you will not provide the information you have. Anytime someone has questioned the ABDSP position you have stated that we are questioning the integrity of the ABDSP staff. The ABDSP has made blind accusations about numerous and/or hundreds of Geocaches that have been placed in sensitive areas that are damaging their surroundings. Without providing any information to investigate these claims. No one is questioning the integrity, we are questioning how they made this decision. If the ABDSP is monitoring this thread then I invite them to provide the GC numbers of the hundreds of caches in violation and the nature of the violation. So Groundspeak and local cachers can verify this. Two years ago in South Carolina a state legislator attempted to ban Geocaching within South Carolina. When she brought her proof forward it turned out to that some claims had been misrepresented and others had been invented.

You have a personal, high school, childhood friend who from the sounds of your earlier posts you haven't heard from since high school, at least 10 years. They have provided you possible proof to damage created by Geocachers which you cannot share because you have to protect their anonymity. So we have to take your word for it. Your right we don't know the level of communication you have and you seem to be getting information others do not. So how do we know you that your e-mails are not being used as facts, since you have a dialouge going on. Trail Gators live and cache in the area of this park and are more aware of the local issues surronding this matter than you are. Unless your contact is willing to be more open about the information they have provided you. Your communication with the park staff could be compounding the problem as they may see you as a Geocacher instead of a Geocaher from Iowa.

Since Egami has entered this thread I have gotten really tired of the way it has played out. I have been involved with one county agency and one state agency who wanted to ban Geocaching from their properties and watched what happened in South Carolina about two years ago. In these situations I’ve seen attempts to ban Geocaching using guidelines that are not evenly enforced and making claims about the damage that Geocaches and Geocachers have created with no documentation or invented it to support these claims. Yes I remain very skeptical of the park staff’s claims of the extent of the damage. They have offered no direct evidence of their claims. Just a lot of vague statements about hundreds or numerous caches that have been placed in sensitive areas. In my experience once actual proof of their claims is brought forward the actual damage caused by Geocaching is nominal to non-existent. Geocaching is often held responsible for damage because there is a website and a cache, unlike mountain bikers, ATV users or any other groups that have far more traffic in a an area. If Egami wants to help this situation the best thing he can offer is to stop communicating with the park staff and let the local reviewer and Miss Jenn find a way to resolve this locally. As a resident of Pennsylvania I knew Miss Jenn for several years, she is a former cache reviewer and is currently a Ground Speak lackey. In 2003 she negotiated with Pennsylvania state park and forest system a Geocaching policy, at a time when very few places knew about Geocaching or even had policies. While he is protecting the anonymity of a park ranger and the contents of the e-mails there is no way he can make the same claim. A Geocacher from Iowa is not going to be familiar with the local issues in California, your e-mails may create more misleading information. This park had policy in place for six years and benefited from CITO’s every six months, a sudden reversal with no warning or coordination with the Geocaching community coupled with vague claims of damage require a healthy dose of skepticism. We’ve all seen government employees over the years who have made decision based on political agendas and not real issues. This isn’t about the parks staff integrity, rather its about questioning a sudden policy change.

Thats pretty impressive that woodpeckers can create that kind of damage. My initial thoughts were only bear could have had that effect, thats one group of determined woodpeckers.

The Cache

One thing to keep in mind abouta mountain locator unit, they are not a constant tracking device and are intended to be used in case of an emergency. When you turn it on it sends a signal to a monitoring station through a sattelite, once that happens search and rescue in the area is notified. These climbers were prepared and experienced and did all the right things. A locator beacon can only tell people where you are and it is presumed you need help, it does not provide two communication to tell someone you are over due and safe. Mountain locator Unit and how they work. They are not as accurate as a Personal Locator beacon.

In ten years I will have found 1000 caches, own a yellow jeep, and will still mourn the loss of Mitsuko and the joy she brought to these forums.

I lost the screw that goes in the back of my Magellan Meridian Gold, the one that you attach the lanyard to. Any suggestions on finding a replacement? Preferably one that can be found at my local hardware store.

While I'm glad that everything worked out for the best, its stories like this that people need to read when they take their dog off leash in the woods. Once a dog gets a scent you may find it impossible to call the dog back to you. I hope more people will think about how close the dog came to drowning and the risk of injury or death to the owner from hypothermia. Keep your dog on leash and it will be better for all.

I set out little envelopes with forgien coins, number 2 or 3 size enevolopes. Don't bother buying them on E-bay, they'll kill you with shipping. Call some of your local coin dealers, there is one near me who has a 5 gallon bucket full of junk forgein coins and he sells them to me for $6 a pound. I put them in an aluminum foil pan, soak them in ammonia for 24 hours, rinse them off with some water, and they look shiny and new. Just make sure to set the pan outside because of the fumes and get an aluminum pan from the supermarket as the dirt that falls off the coins will stain the pan.

I have a multi cache in my area that requires visiting 5 covered bridges and requires about 25 miles of driving. The purpose of Geocaching is to go outside and explore and you would have the same problem if you used Google earth instead of the one you want to list. The website is a commercial venture that has advertisments, it doesn't matter how unobtrusive they are.

Thanks, Joe. I'll have to remember your post the next time someone states that WalMart's policies would forbid any caches on their property. Joe can correct me if I'm wrong, but from what I'm reading, the property in question was developed by Wal-Mart as a park. It is not a Wal-Mart parking lot. A parking lot was built with the intent to allow people to park. A park is built with the intent to be outside. Your suggestion that this example shows that Wal-Mart will allow caches at their parking lots & retail establishments is a faulty argument. There is “NO” faulty argument, caches are allowed at Wal-Marts any where with permission "" Period "" I have to agree with JoGPS on this one. Read it again carefully, Wal-Mart set aside 12 acres to be undeveloped and 5 acres as conservation easment. Thats 17 acres of property Wal-Mart owns, period.

Before everyone decides to burn the reporter in effigy you missed the next sentence which read: Sounds like an accurate description to me. Your missing the main point here, Wal-Mart(commercial business) + private property x bomb squad = possible phone call from Wal-Mart legal department.

Remember the scene in Animal House with the pledge being paddled and every time he gets hit he says "Thank you sir, may I have another". Thats what it takes to become a volunteer with GC.com. You don't volunteer for the job, you get volunteered.

and after this incedent with the bomb squad, Wal-Mart's legal department may be in touch with Groundspeak since the caches are on private property. Nothing lowers your daily sales totals like having the bomb squad close down the parking lot or makes customers uncomfortable about shopping there.

Couldn't find a listing for the Philadelphia area. If anyone does please post the time and date.

Give Miss Jenn some time to work on this back in 2002 she negotiated a Geocaching policy with the with agency that handles the Pennsylvania State park and forest systems. I'm sure she'll get good results, but it may take some time. Fortunately there are a number of state agencies that have Geocaching policies and it will be a matter of patience.

You put and old and most likely unstable bomb in your car and drove it out of the area. Your lucky it didn't go off and kill you and the occupants of every car near you. Next time keep the kids away from it, call the police and wait for the cops to arrive. Old unexploded ordnance is not something amateurs should deal with.

I would not use jeans for hiking at all an all cotton garment absorbs and retains water and sweat. If they get wet they draw body heat from you and when they are damp they chafe. I've also found jeans to be to heavy and bulky for hiking. A lot of the hikers I know use hiking pants, decent wind protection and they dry out very quickly when they get wet. I prefer military BDU's, the ones that are a poly/cotton blend. They dry out quickly and I like the thigh pockets, reinforced knees, seat, and button fly.

The TSA couldn't have made the explanation any more confusing. I keep expecting to see a weird addendum that reads "if this is the third Wednesday, with a month that ends with the letter Y, and you are eating chocolate pudding...."

Next time read all the posts. You would have seen the one about how there were guidelines specifically negotiated with the ABDSP and have been in place for a few years. As well as a CITO every 6 months. Until all the facts are in this appears to be a new park superintendent who has been given misinformation and failed to confirm if it was true and talk to the parks Geocaching contacts.

Trail Gators, good luck in getting this resolved. Until you get all of the facts the posts from most of the people in this thread, especially those who do not live in the area is conjecture. I hope you'll keep us updated. I lived in Florida when we had a similar incident in 2003 when a Superintendent for a state agency that managed about 500,000 acres throughout Florida was given a lot of misinformation about Geocaching. He reacted similarly, fortunately calmer heads prevailed it took a few weeks of work to get it resolved. Sounds like the current superintendent over reacted without talking to everyone involved. I'm very mystified given the fact that negotiated guidelines have been in effect for several years.

You should consider renting one of these. Especially if you are going to do this solo, you never know when an emergency could occur. Google, "personal locater beacon rental".