mchaos
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Posts posted by mchaos
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Anyone who thinks that removing soil by "coring" is within the guidelines is an idiot.
***This is not a personal attack. It's a generic comment. It is not meant to address any one person's opinion or thought.
If that was the case, a better choice of a word other then stupid would be much better.
By saying, "Anyone who thinks that removing soil by "coring" is within the guidelines is an idiot." you are insinuating that I am an idiot.
Perhaps something like this would be less of an attack,
"Anyone who thinks that removing soil by "coring" is within the guidelines should consult a reviewer.."
As your comment was, that would be called offensive.
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Both valid points.
This rule is definitely for stopping holes everywhere. I will be getting specific permission to place this. As well it will not be buried. Nor will any tool be used for retrieving it.
I am sure it will be allowed as long as I have specific permission to do so.
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You already posted this under the "cool cache containers" thread and received several comments. Why are you posting it in a new separate thread? Trying to find the one cacher who will say "sure, no problem"? Not to mention the fact that there have been several threads dedicated to caches in the ground.
Lock time!
He's posting to a new thread by request so that we can keep all the discussion on the subject here instead of muddying up the CCC thread.
Here here. As well gratebear if you had read in the CCC thread it was asked to make a new thread as too keep it out of the CCC's thread.
As well, I asked a specific opinion, and regardless of what any one says, I am and already have sought permission to place the cache as intended. As well I will not place it with out that permission.
Once I have permission I will contact the reviewer and hash it out then. There are caches of this type, and placed with permission.
I will not do it if it can't be done, although I will intently seek a way to do it.
As well, should I come across an existing hole, it may just get placed there, provided it is okay to do so.
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I have a cache that would have to be partially in the ground.
Would coring the ground, which is by definition, "not digging" nor will a pointy, or sharp tool be used, or any kind of object to dig. Simply a piece of pipe driven into the ground, and then pulled out removing a core of dirt?
Next.....
If a hole existed already, and I did not make said hole. And I did not make it to place a cache, and I was given permission to place a cache in said hole..... Would that be a violation of the rules????
It will not be "Buried"
In those cases where I have seen similarly placed caches, the cache owner had gotten explicit permission from the land owner for such placement due to digging being against the guidelines in any form. In at least one case, it took several months of back and forth communication before they were given permission for exactly what you are describing. I'm going to guess that each of those cases likely had to clearly inform the reviewer of said permission before the cache was even considered. Chances are that if you cannot prove clear permission from the land owner for such a placement, most reviewers, if not all reviewers (I can't speak for all reviewers...just for what the guidelines say), are going to deny the cache.
EDIT: Oh yeah, and just a reminder that prior cache placement is usually not considered as proof that a future placement is okay. That's also something clearly said in the guidelines. Most reviewers would probably tell you that if you tried to argue "Well it's been done before."
Would coring the ground, which is by definition, "not digging" nor will a pointy, or sharp tool be used, or any kind of object to dig. Simply a piece of pipe driven into the ground, and then pulled out removing a core of dirt?Next.....
If a hole existed already, and I did not make said hole. And I did not make it to place a cache, and I was given permission to place a cache in said hole..... Would that be a violation of the rules????
If you own the property, then there is a bit of flexibility, even if some might feel that it encourages similar hides.
If you do not own the property but have written permission (I'm assuming you'd need written permission for something like this), then I would guess it would be very similar to property you owned.
If you manage to find an existing hole that works, then it should not be a problem. For instance, if you were to find an abandoned well and built a cache that went over it and looked like a drain, then that should be fine.
If you core the hole, then you are going to run afoul of the guidelines. Even though the coring tool may be blunt, it still removes earth and if you were to remove the cache, then it would be obvious something was missing.
Toz may say this is someone enforcing their own version of the guidelines. However, I believe the spirit of that particular guideline is to ensure that the ground is not removed.
Using a thin steel rod, for instance, to stake a cache would probably be fine because if you were to pull the cache up and step on the hole, no one would ever know you had a cache there. You have simply displaced the earth rather than removed it.
But you should really consult with your local reviewer to get a solid answer.
I think I have already shown that I have no problem seeking permission and that I will engage in seeking permission. However this time I will not place it until I have it. As a matter of fact I have already sent an email along to the person in charge of the land.
I'm quite certain the land owners would rather you use the device in a safe area off to the side of the golf course.....rather than to occupy an existing hole on the green.
HAHA, funny. I had actually been thinking while making this of some way to make the container in the hole, but not to limit the functionality of the hole. Of course it would be silly to put it on the course. Was just a thought. I am sure a golfer would not want to wait for some one to finagle the hole before he tee's off.
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a "shovel", a "trowel", or "other "pointy" object is used to dig" will not be used.
I have started a new thread here.
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I have a cache that would have to be partially in the ground.
Would coring the ground, which is by definition, "not digging" nor will a pointy, or sharp tool be used, or any kind of object to dig. Simply a piece of pipe driven into the ground, and then pulled out removing a core of dirt?
Next.....
If a hole existed already, and I did not make said hole. And I did not make it to place a cache, and I was given permission to place a cache in said hole..... Would that be a violation of the rules????
It will not be "Buried"
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If you wish to threat. And or to act high and mighty. Or just to plain old try to be more right then some one, by all means start any thread you want.
"Caches that are buried. If a shovel, trowel or other "pointy" object is used to dig, whether in order to hide or to find the cache, then it is not appropriate."
No where in that description does it say anything about producing a hole. Did you jump up and throw the rules at that cache some where in this thread that was a soda can, that had a small container under it, the pressed into the ground, "Producing a hole"?
The monument at the first cache.. I do believe they used shovels and other "pointy" objects is used to dig" to set that monument. That is a direct violation of the rules. Why was that Okay????
I will simply find an existing hole that I have been given permission to place this cache in, and put it there. It would then, NOT be in violation of the rules.
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I won't be digging. I will be coring the ground.
Definition of Core on dictionary.com, number 4. (in mining, geology, etc.) a cylindrical sample of earth, mineral, or rock extracted from the ground by means of a corer so that the strata are undisturbed in the sample.
The definition does not contain the word dig. It is not digging the ground.
Now, lets say that this is on my own property? Lets say I was already digging up a hole for some other reason, or the hole already exists. Say I just put the container in that hole and leave it?
For any reason a hole is there, if it is okay to place the cache in that hole, it is not in a violation of the rules.
Perhaps there is a hole. And I place the cache in the hole, then fill the sides in with dirt available and I did not dig this hole?
If I do not use "a shovel, trowel or other "pointy" object is used to dig" Then I am not in violation of the rules.
This rule is bias. One cannot slightly dig into the ground if permission is given, to hide a cache that is not buried, but one can alter a standing structure with permission to hide a cache.
I am sorry but the is a loose rule, especially because there are many caches that are some what in the ground, and a pointy object used to dig may have been used to place it. I will just make sure that I do not violate the rule as it reads.
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Ah yes. I am not going to use any pointy objects. I am going to core a hole for it. Its not pointy at all. As a matter of fact the edge is very dull.
I have seen hides like this before as well has hides where as a shovel would have been needed, unless the CO used their bare hands which I doubt.
I have seen, fake lawn sprinkler hides and Water main boxes in the ground. These are all in the ground. As well i have seen another on this thread where the container was in the ground. I don't think a shovel was needed, but still in the ground. I am sure it was cored, which is the method of which I will be placing this cache. As well it is going to be some where that I have permission to place it.
I don't think I will be breaking any rules on this one. It is not buried, merely in the ground.
Here is another example of a cache of the same nature.
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Here is my newest cache container. I just finished it. It is a fake drain cache.
Together
Cache container pulls out of sleeve that will be in the ground.
Container and sleeve.
View 1 of container drain cover.
View 2 of the plug which seals the container.
Under the drain cover is painted flat black so it is not visible.
I am planning to place this little guy some where tomorrow. I was going to make it a small however I think you can fit as much swag in this as a regular sized lock and lock. What do you think, small or regular??
EDIT: Typo.
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sigh,
how did i know this topic would end in a discussion on gun control?
Because all of your threads are loaded and aimed at causing controversy.
Can any one tell me where the ignore button is?
Gonna ignore me? Cool, then I can start talking behind your back.
No no, not you.
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People are gonna drive every where any way. I know people that will put a bag of garbage on the hood of their car and drive down the drive way to put it in the can.
People drive what they could easily walk in a few moments.
If not geocaching, something else would fill the void for what to drive around for.
On the positive side, I get out more, and bike and hike more. I think the game is 100 times more positive then negative.
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Can any one tell me where the ignore button is?
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Here is my contribution...
- Starting at Google maps point: N40° 59.###" W-74° 57.###"
- GPSr reported location: N 40° 58.### W -74° 57###
- GPSr reported accuracy: 174ft
- Starting at Google maps point: N40° 59.###" W-74° 57.###"
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as for my own caches, the only cache where i can even try to use google is my one and only LPC (which is a puzzle cache). the difference is .002 minutes in the latitude and .001 in the longitude
Cool. So that's two data points now:
- Standing at Google Maps point: N 51 51.### W 002 04.###
- GPSr reported location: N 51 51.###-004 W 002 04.###-002
- GPSr reported accuracy: 131 feet
- Standing at Google Maps point: N 43 ##.### W 080 ##.###
- GPSr reported location: N 43 ##.###±002 W 080 ##.###±001
- GPSr reported accuracy: ?
Any more? How about the original poster?
This is a waste of time. Your GPS is not going to give the same reading every time you go back to that spot. (At least, mine doesn't.)
That's mot what its about. They are taking a point on google maps, then checking it against a GPS to see the accuracy of Google maps.
Generally speaking google maps can be anywere from 50 to 300 ft off. They are trying to get instances from all over to see accuracy other places.
And, My GPS gets dadgum close....
- Standing at Google Maps point: N 51 51.### W 002 04.###
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I have once question that will sum it all up....
"Do you hide a geocache for people to find, or not to find?"
Whats the point of hiding a cache so that no one can find it? I can understand a little challenge, but you want some one to find it.
And the hint is there to give some one a helping hand if they can't find it.
I typically try to hide things creatively and in interesting or Non saturated area's. For instance I have a container I just made. Its very tricky. it is a piece of cement rubble. Flip it over and it has a lock&lock in it. I basically dug a small hole, poured cement into it, then pressed the container into it. Let it dry then dug it out and rinsed it off. Now I have what looks like building rubble but on the bottom is the container. I am hiding it in a place where there is other cement rubble. There are no caches in the area, that's why I chose the area. I want it to be some what challenging, but I want people to find it. So in the hint I am going to put either just the word "Rubble" Or which I think is better, "One mans rubble is another man's treasure."
If people have a hard time finding it, I will change the hint to simply, " Look under pieces of rubble." Because I want people to be able to find it.
A geocache should only be very hard for a muggle to find. The hole point of geocaching is to leave something for some one else to find.
I understand that every one has their own things they like, but essentially that's what it is.
There is challenging, and then there is aggravating.
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There is a specific cache in NC a few miles from my dads house, where in trackables just go missing. Its like some one is watching it for trackables. I left one in that cache before I noticed the trend, and it went missing. I feel really bad, I wanted to see this trackable reach its goal.
As for forgetting about them. I some times hold on to them for a bit longer then I should. But I always send them off. I have one right now that coming with me to FL in Oct. So I will have it for a bit, but I noted that on the log.
I have seen many in very nice heat sealed sleeves with the mission note. Those are good because its unmistakable.
I recently got my first travel bug. Its been a while before I decided to get one, because I have seen too many go missing. So I got a patch that I put on my Geocaching pack. I won't be setting this one off into the wild.
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so wait, youre saying trying to determine cache location from satellite view through a google map is a bad idea? I should trust my constantly jumping around gps compas, or radar to find the cache, whereas google maps tends to be very consistant,
What do you use radar for? Only in the context of geocaching please, I know what radar is used for.
To the OP. Google Earth is okay for getting a general idea of where a cache is/might be but it is not considered appropriate for placing caches.
radar as in the geocaching android app, not like weather radar
Okay, first off a satellite is taking pictures from fixed points in the sky, as you move up or down the pictures the angle from the satellite changes, there for making the map some what inaccurate.I have seen that app, and know some one who uses it. It has never shown more then 7ft close to the cache, even when right on top of it. With my Triton I can always get to 00 on the distance from cache, and in most cases, if the coordinates were taken from a reliable unit, then I can drop my gps and it will land on the cache. (little exaggeration but I mean it puts me right were it is. Dead on.) Several times it has brought me standing over the cache. There was a nano I found, bison tube in the woods. It was in a hole drilled into a fallen tree. I would have never found it except that my GPS brought me right to the spot, I nearly set the gps on 00 on top of where the nano was in the tree. saw a loose piece of bark, and moved it and there it was. Your not gonna do that with a droid.
IMO and quite a few others I am sure, smart phones are much less reliable to place caches.
I have seen decent consistency with Google maps and others, but its still not accurate enough to place a cache. Besides, the RULES say that you cannot use Google maps or variants to obtain coords for placing a cache, So its a moot point!
Besides. "Radar" is just an app that displays how close you are to the GZ. It has nothing to do with the GPS receiver hardware in the phone. Its just not that accurate.
Do a Google search for "Droid GPS accuracy" and you will turn up numerous articles stating that the droids GPS is "widely off". From what I have read, the best you can get with a droid is about 10ft accuracy. That dribble compared to the 3ft accuracy I get with my unit, and most other GPS units.
Droid sux on batteries. Is not as sensitive as GPS units, in a thick wooded area, good luck with it.
As far as taking an accurate waymark for a cache placement, You should always let your GPS "Settle" before you mark it. I let mine settle fore a few minutes before I mark the placement.
My gps coords never jump around, unless I am moving, but it should then LoL.
EDIT: So as for taking coords for a cache placement, On google earth, how are you sure you are putting the pointer right were your cache is?? You should be taking the coords from the precise placement. There is no way, even with the droids poor 10ft accuracy if you get that even, its still much better then google maps. In a lot of cases its 20 ft, its still more accurate then google maps because you can set the droid down on top of the placement, let it settle, then waymark it. Then if its even 20 ft off from the exact cache placement, not an unknown amount of feet away. You cannot possibly click on the exact place the cache is hidden on google maps. You are not supposed to just take a waymark of some where in the area of the cache. It should be the coords right were the cache is.
If you want to make it harder by making the coords off on purpose, then make it a mystery cache.
So even though your droid is not the greatest for taking coords for a placement, it would be a lot better then using Google maps. If you like geocaching so much, go buy a specific GPSr. Wally world is clearance out the Triton series I have seen it for as little as $100 for a T400. You can always hit up ebay. I once got an explorist 210 for $30 shipped.
Ustune: As for the original question, You are trying to sync up an image with physical coordinates. To get as close as it is, is really darn good!
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Are you serious? I mean you have to be kidding me...
Nano's can hold a lot of signatures. Its in the way you roll the log. In a blinky its a strip of paper about 1/4 inch wide Rolled tight and it fits right into the blinky. You sign you name on the strip width ways, instead of up and down. In a nano bison you can roll a normal micro log and it will fit.
See how the log is? You can fit a lot of signatures on that. They are easy to make.
Any container that holds at least a log is a geocache.
Some of these questions are starting to get monotonous.
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hmmm....
my poor reviewer, must loath my new listings, this one for example ive been tying to get published for close to two weeks, cause i kept trying to figure out ways to get around this proximity issue, all this work to hide a dang cache, i think ill take my cache down, and see if i can place it somewhere else, AGAIN, or ill flip a coin to try again or forget it, since the cache in question is mine also i could move that one 50ft farther away, then recheck my coords at gz of the one waiting to be published and see if i was off before, and could maybe squeeze by the 528ft rule. jeesh what a pain,
You have to check these things. Its just something that has to be done. perhaps its a neat place to hid a cache. Make a choice. The existing one, or the new one. Which is better.
If both cache hiding spots are really good, I say make it a multi like others have said. I'd make the new cache the first leg of it. Then people would get to look there.
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I was going to answer this but it was answered many times already LoL.
Just don't hid a micro unless its something special. Special meaning like something creative. Not just a pill bottle under a lamp post. Try to do something different.
Here is a good example of a creative cache. I recently found a really cool cache. It was a small, but if ya did the same thing with micro it still would be special.
It was off a trail. There was a tree with some wood pecker holes in it. There was one dead limb that stood out. When you pulled on it, it came out with a part of the tree, which was actually plaster I think, made to look like bark. It filled the hole and looked like the tree. Connected to that was a small water tight container.
Now that was cool. If that was a micro I would still be just as cool.
If you can hide it in the open, and no one can see it, then its a micro worth being hidden.
Here is a list of boring cache types. IMO any way....
LPH's
Anything on a guard rail.
Almost any 35mm canisters, unless its in some kind of tricky camo. Cast into a rock is cool.
Just about any micro in the woods. There are some exceptions. I have seen only a few.
I am sure some people like those kinds, but I am sure most people would like to find something fun.
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HEY. I need my POCKET QuERieS!!!!!!!!
Gotta have em. HANDS DOWN. $30 a year? OH BLAH. You probably spend more then that on fast food in a week for lunches. What do you get out of that except Fat with bad cholesterol?
You can equate the cost to almost anything. Renting movies. Renting from on demand. Cigarettes(could own geocaching by now).
$30 a year to get some of the nice features like pocket queries is nothing.
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I have used this site for long distance DX contacts over the radio to figure out how far away they are. Works good, and I believe you can put coords in it.
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it appears that there was no trouble activating this cache as it is now active.
Okay, first off a satellite is taking pictures from fixed points in the sky, as you move up or down the pictures the angle from the satellite changes, there for making the map some what inaccurate.
Would this be a violation of the rules?
in General geocaching topics
Posted
If I core an apple am I digging the apple??
If I core Ice, am i digging the ice?
What ever its a moot point. I am seeking permission already. It won't matter interpretations of definitions or wording of rules.
If i get permission to place it, and the reviewer will publish it, I am gonna use a dadgum shovel, and a trowel,and a few other objects used to dig