Eclectic_Penguin

I will try to explain it again, please try to understand it once. I have numbered all your points below to make it for you check against the original please do. 1. I said that I did not want anyone telling me how I should be doing geocaching and I did not want to tell anyone how they should geocache. 2. I said I do not go geocaching to write in logs but more to see interesting places associated with geocaching I am just not into writing in the logs Hence I have never logged any caches. 3. OK you could say that what I do is only walking which is the same as any other cacher except for the logging or not logging of caches. As I said I do not log any finds how can I explain it any simpler than that? And as for the profile with no logs, like I said I do not write logs but do have to log on to the site to get the cache coordinates. As for the "why bother" remark why bother doing anything, nothing we do actually matters (except to the individual at this moment in time), nothing is going to matter from the viewpoint of 100 years in the future. 4. I only complained about the type of whiner & crier who complains how someone else is doing caching and thinks they should be made to do it differently. 5. Good on you for making an effort in your logs. I personally like those type of logs myself where someone makes an effort. 6. I did not say log books are rubbish I said I did not want to go to the effort of writing my name in a log book that is likely to remain unread, in my opinion, as it just contains page after page of logs such as TFTC and NLNT etc. 7. I did not say Groundspeak are moneygrabbers I said that if you can sell 1,000,000 bugs for £5 that is a profitable business which is great. I did bet on Groundspeak maybe not caring what happens to them once they are sold and released and as many people complain on the forums Groungspeak do nothing to help lost or stranded bugs unless you`ve heard different. 8. Thank you for saying that I can keep doing it my way and that what you don`t like people cheating. I always think of cheating as a personal values issue ie I think a persons true value is what they actually do when they know no one is watching them, nothing more nothing less and certainly not what they tell you their values are. 9. I did not, and I did not see anyone saying you should condone cheating. Perhaps you said that for dramatic effect. 10. I`m sorry if you felt that your intelligence was being scrutinised but when I see stupid remarks on a forum I do think "ah HA there must be stupid people around. Fortunately the real truth remains true whether you believe it or not. It also remains there for you to go and check against what you thought I said to what I actually said. So If you want to check points 1 through 10 above and use a little critical thinking you will discover that our thoughts are not too different and that everyone does geocaching differently. Thanks for your replies.

Sorry you misread what I wrote earlier. I can only explain it to you unfortunately I cannot understand it for you but feel free to jump in with your interperatation of what you wanted me to be saying. I was giving advice to thekennelat79 and telling them how I now go about this game called caching and why I do it this way because of all the whiners and criers who think it should be done their way and no other and think it is their right to tell others what to do. Regarding the observation I made about poor logging I said that was not interested in adding my logs in a log book or on line where most logs seemed to be of the quality of just tftc with optional smilyface. That is the reason I was not going to put my time & effort in writing my log in something that is going to be unread, my reason only and why I do it my way. I never want to make anyone do it my way. I am sorry if I misled anyone or if I did not explain myself clearly enough. And as in that old saying about someone who is losing an argument that their last refuge is to be right..... I could see you were so keen to try and point out that you were so right about my comments being ironic, I can only say go back and reread my original try not twist it too far out of context. If however you still need help to understand do not hesitate to ask. It is better to keep your mouth closed and let people think you are a fool than to open it and remove all doubt.-- Mark Twain (1835-1910)

Thank you jady1987 it`s nice to see some common sense on here. So many people want their rights to let their dog run free but do not want to have the burden of their responsibilities of dog ownership. If they cannot control a dog when it "is just being friendly" or "he just wants to play" how are they going to control it when it is tearing skin and flesh off someones face. (For those who think this would not happen just set your browser settings to "do not filter my search results" and google dog attacks uk and check out what really happens in a severe dog attack. WARNING you will see some disturbing Facial injuries especially where it was large dog v small child.) It is just not good enough when the owners of Fluffy are on the news being interviewed just wringing their hands and tearfully telling the nation that "we never thought Fluffy would do this, he is usually so friendly" while a child lies in hospital waiting for facial skin grafts. For those who are going to argue this does not happen here in the UK just google dog attacks and see how many come up. On the point of investing in a hiking pole I carry a B&Q junior hacksaw on my country walks and use it to harvest a good straight hazel stick about 25 to 30mm diameter from a hedgerow and cut it to shoulder height in length.... perfect, cheap and I am not concerned about damaging it when using it to bash through nettles or brambles on caching trips. It also makes that very satisfying THWACK sound against the back or ribs of an out of control dog. To all those hard of thinking I shall simplyfy things for you to save all the huffing & puffing and posturing that if I ever did that to your dog etc etc 1. I do not advocate beating any dog at random for no reason whatsoever. 2. Violence should only used to defend ones self from attack, and as with any defense the violence should be increased until the problem is overcome. 3. Self defense, as in any attack (human or animal), should never consist of curling up into a ball and crying out "Get him off me". It should, For maximum effect, take place suddenly with enough force to end the threat if possible and without any pity for the assailant that decided to attack you in the first place. My motto in any defense situation is always that if I am going to come second place in a fight I am going to make dadgum sure, through my effort, that it is going to be a close second. WALES the land where it is sunny 365 days every year, it`s just a shame that clouds get in the way most days.

I can offer my advice and tell you what I do. I go caching fairly regularly and I never log any finds. What is the point of trying to write the letters tftc and only that in a damp and musty smelling notebook (and around here the notebooks seem mainly to be ones stolen from the local education authority as they are marked as school notebooks but that subject is for another day) I also do not bother to go through the rigmarole of logging onto the site to just type a log that just consists of tftc and a smilyface emoticon as many seem to do. The same goes for travel bugs, in the early days I would move a travel bug and I would receive a grumpy email telling me off for not logging it fast enough or telling me I had not moved it in the right direction so now I never log them either which saves me from answering the nitpicking emails from what I call the whiners and criers. These whiners and criers, common in all areas of life these days, always whine and cry about other people not doing it their way, and can`t someone make them do it "right". They even whine and cry about it to Groundspeak but nothing will ever get done because once they have sold you the £5 travel bug they have made their money and don`t care if it travels 1km or 1,000,000km they only care that more cachers buy more bugs £5 each x 1,000,000 travel bugs = a profitable business So there is my practical advice, get over your shallow need for everyones numbers to be correct and certified and try the fun experience of finding new and interesting places through the game of geocaching and forget the urge to get all the numbers right and the need to show others how many caches you`ve visited and logged in the right and proper manner. So to sum it all up just go out and enjoy YOUR geocaching, you may even find it`s a fun game and end up less tense. WALES .... The land that global warming forgot.

We don`t need to come to an agreement but I don`t know what I could have done better. If I had not defended myself I would have been bitten then several months down the line during the court case the judge would have agreed that I should not have been bitten and that the attacking dogs should now die. Result... The pain of the bite, time off work for court case, 2 dead dogs an even more upset owner (complete with more bubbles of snot and tears). All I ask is that owners of dogs should, as the law says, keep them under control so that no one gets hurt. So as you say we probably won`t come to an agreement but can you at least agree with the law that dog owners should keep their animals under control for the safety of the public? Yes have a good one yourself. "You may disagree with what I think but that does not mean you should stop thinking" Dr. Gregory House.

If I was not attacked I would not have defended myself, but I was attacked and only about one and a half seconds to decide what to do. With the luxury of time I could think about what to do for longer but as I rank humans way higher than dogs I was not going to let the dog bite me so I defended myself. And whilst you like seeking and finding, seek through my original text and find that I said due to being 2 dogs, the speed and agression of the attack I misjudged the force and placement of the defensive strike but all ended well and no humans were harmed. Thinking on it now perhaps the police should be involved and they can organise the death of these dangerous attacking dogs. I`ll leave that to you seeing that you want everything done right.

As a wise man once told me "If you were not so stupid I would be able to explain to you how stupid your argument is". as I said I resolve the problem at the time. All the clues are there. If the dogs were kept under control neither dog nor human would come to any harm. Please do not embelish my story beyond the facts of what happened ie out of control dogs outnumbered me, attacked, I defended myself. Result .... Problem sorted. Please do not imagine that I go around beating well behaved dogs but if I am attacked I will defend myself and save myself from a trip to hospital.

I do not like dogs and admit to being afraid of being attacked by an out of control dog. I do not understand why people want to keep a dagerous animal. Also when you go into a dog owners home have you noticed you can always smell that dog smell? Anyway........ A license does not stop a dog from biting or jumping up with muddy feet. A microchip does not stop a dog from biting or jumping up with muddy feet. Paying a tax every year to own an animal does not stop a dog from biting or jumping up with muddy feet. It is already illegal for a dog to bite someone so adding another law, tax or opening another council department to waste public money is not going to stop a dog from biting or jumping up with muddy feet. The only way is to address the problem directly. My favourite is the use of my trusty 5 foot long hiking staff (a real wooden one not one of the new fangled lightweight alloy ones) which I now always use on rough ground due to an old rugby injury. When a dog runs towards me I hold the stick up above my head and shout to the owner to "Control your dog". If the dog still runs in for the bite or muddy paw prints on the trousers bring the stick down sharply onto the back or ribs of the dog and the problem just goes away (usually at high speed and with high pitched squealing). Do try not to hit the head as this may harm the dog. I was once attacked by two large dogs that came running at me barking fiercely and really looking as if they meant business and in the heat of the moment with great fear for my wellbeing I misjudged the force used and misaimed and clouted one dog on the head. This time instead of a yelping noise it made a strange snorting noise one of its eyes bulged out and it seemed to acquire a strange walking impediment where it sort of moved diagonally backwards and fell into the canal, swam to the other side and just clung on making a strange sound. Luckily the second dog then also jumped into the canal and swam around the first barking at it, Problem solved. The owner was trying to call the dogs to him and mumbled to me, through tears and bubbles of snot, "I didnt need to do that to him he doesn`t bite"(the usual excuse) I just reminded him that if he had kept his animals under control everyone would still be happy and continued my way along the towpath. Why should we live in fear? everyone should own a good sturdy hiking pole and dog attacks on people would decrease.

The worst thing is that the magazine article didn`t stress the importance of writing the letters tftc and nothing more in the soggy log book and to then remove a soggy and musty smelling McDonalds toy without leaving anything in return. How will new cachers ever get up to speed with Geocaching 2011 and beyond? PS To all new cachers who were introduced to caching from this article don`t forget to rewrap the cache in the wet Tesco carrier bag and always nearly replace it in the hiding place with part of the cache showing like most of the cachers seem to do these days.