NBJPoppa

I wish to raise a "hear! hear!" for NomadRaven's recent post. This is truly something to consider, and it is an issue that comes up in almost *every* activity. We all have to *train* the "youngsters" -- no matter their age. So Moun10Bike has revealed that his skin is not mde of armored-plate steel. Good! I hope he doesn't mind me using him as an example. Now Moun10Bike has been at this sport for long enough that he's managed to hide over 60 caches. If somehow, God forbid, he makes a really miserable hide, then perhaps he would deserve a "YCS" comment. However, I still think it would be better to send such a comment via private e-mail first, and only resort to a public flogging if he's just recalcitrant. On the other hand, Joe Newbie has found 1 cache and has decided to hide 10 in his first week of caching. (Jane Newbie, of course, wouldn't go overboard so quickly, right? ) If Joe has a really awful cache I would think it best to cut him (or her) a little slack and send a message to complain to him directly. Perhaps a little education and mentoring would be the best solution to the problem. So what do we do if Joe doesn't learn or is "pig headed" about it? I'm not sure if there is a good solution here. I mean, perhaps The Approvers could develop relationship with "Trusted Cache Raters" who would help separate the wheat from the chaff, but then you might irk Joe Newbie so that he runs around trashing other caches. I guess it gets back to a user rating system, where the users can rate the quality of each cache and also that of the cache hider. Simple, yeah? Someone could surely hack this out in, what, 3 hours? Not a chance! Unlike E-bay ratings, though, negative feedback isn't a necessity for new players. I guess I would just say "take it easy". Maybe keep notes on whose caches *you* do/don't like, and manage your own problem yourself. *I'm* trying to do that, too.

What, just one coin for Navdog for all the work he's done? And one other for Pepper? Hmm. What about splitting all the single-digit coins between them? Or should someone else (Moun10Bike) be in the running for the single-digit coins?

Umm. Something now occurs to me. If we are going to order these coins through the WSGA web site, how will they be numbered? Will they be pre-numbered at the mint, or is someone "at WSGA" going to hand-stamp them all?

It's too true! I saw the very jigsaw puzzle earlier this evening! (Wednesday night.) One is finished, and two more are in the works. I even got to see the bloodstain on the carpet! Actually, many thanks to Pepper for loaning me a GPSr to use on my trip to Spokane on Friday -- and for some lessons on how to use one of these new-fangled thingies!

What's all this stuff about shredded cash pages? Are you making money or something?

Not that I can add to Criminal's post, but a thought occurred to me. Most of you, I'm sure, are aware of Amazon.com, right? It has this unique feature that lets user rate the books they read. I guess this is similar to E-Bay's user ratings. Maybe geocaching.com could implement something similar. Hmm... Not sure quite how it would work, though. We could rate hide on a difficulty level, cleverness of the puzzle, beauty (or lack thereof) of the site, etc... Sounds like a lot of work. Never mind.

Sorry I wasn't more clear in my note. The Snohomish County Geocoin is a USA Geocoin named "Snohomish County Geocoin". It is owned by jcar.

I seem to remember a note from (if I recall correctly) Durang00 a few months ago. His complaint about recent caches was something along the lines of "caches used to be beautiful spots that you might never find on your own, but now too many of them are a can dumped in a ditch -- yeah, what fun jump into a ditch!" Although I've purchased about 16 ammo cans, as well as assorted other containers (including Bison capsures) I have yet to place anything. I have scouted several locations, but two things keep me from placing. First I have to get around to cleaning and re-painting the ammo cans. Getting rid of the ammo details. We don't need to involve another bomb squad, do we? Of course, that might lend some excitement to the sport. The other issue has to do with Durang00's comment. Yeah, this is a "good" hiding place, but why should I bring someone out here? Take, for instance, the recent Hamlin Hobbit Hole cache. I think that Wienerdog pointed out that this is now the fourth cache in this park. Granted it is a large park, but does it need four (or more) caches? Well, I suppose if you go in and "just get the cache" then more caches will help you see more of the park. You know, I really liked the old Coulon Cache (GC8100), which is now archived. I had seen the park on the map, but had never been into it. This multi-cache seemed to take me all over the park, and it is a fantastic park! It looks like a really fun place to take the kids, and you can picnic on the water! However I also like thematic caches. WD's BOOM series, of which I've found 1. On the other hand, perhaps I am different from most cachers. (Actually, I've always been told that I'm different.) I haven't really gone after numbers of caches found. My focus, as k7-wave so aptly put it, is on Travel Bug finds. For me the major motivation for finding a new cache has been the presence of a TB. Yes, lately I've been on a brief cache-finding binge, but that was only because I have to ship my GPSr/cell phone back to California, and I won't have a unit. What's the attraction of TBs? I guess it was kind of a coincindence, but the first cache I found (Bug Hunt - Victory!) had a TB in it, and it's goal was to get to Deception Pass State Park. I took my kids up there (I had never been) and left the TB. Except for the Motel 9 3/4 Travel Bug Motel, an ammo can looks like an ammo can. The TBs, on the other hand, are quite varied. I've taken photographs of nearly every TB I've found, but I haven't yet posted most of those. Anyway. Enough rambling for now.

I recenlty picked up the GeoCoin "Snohomish County Geocoin". It was inside a plastic sleeve similar to those shown in Pepper's post. (The Vinyl Sleeve.) Anyway the sleeve broke in half, and so the insert will become separated from the pocket that holds the coin. I used scotch-tape to put them back together, but that's not going to last very long. The hard case looks like it would last longer, but where would you put the data sheet? Maybe we could find something like those "proof" boxes that coin collectors use for the "2004 Mint Proof set". You know - room for the coin AND for a note as well.

I haven't been following this thread all that closely lately (due to other events) but I didn't get the feeling that people expressly didn't want to track them. Rather I thought that the issue was the "hassle factor". Personally I would like to be able to track them. Granted, we probably are all aware of how the ability to track something easily doesn't mean it will be tracked. (Rhetorical Question: How often have you found that a TB was not in the cache where it was listed? Check out the Travel Bug Rest Stop as an example.) Nonetheless I found trying to track the Canadian GeoCoins to be somewhat cumbersome, simply because it wasn't linked. My two and a half cents. (Inflation, don cha know?)

Well, I'm not sure that this is the right place to do this, but... it almost fits. I've reached a milestone of sorts. Back on June 1, 2003 I began working for a company based in California. To to this work I was provided with a NexTel cellular phone. Last October I began geocaching using the cell phone as my GPS receiver. All well and good. However, the contract for which I was employed was rather abruptly terminated, and I must ship the cell phone back to California. Thus my milestone is having found so many caches and Travel Bugs using a "brain dead" GPSr. Pepper, as I've mentioned before, has suggested to me several times that I needed to get a "real" GPSr. So now the problem is: what should I get? By the way, I tend not to spend money on something until I understand what I am getting. I don't expect to go for a "base" model. A month after I was caching Totemlake showed me his Platinum Meridian GPSr, but the bells and whistles went right over my head. (OK, so it has a built-in compass. Do I care? Well, *now* I do. Routes. I understand the concept, but is it really useful? Storing waypoints. Hmm, someone showed me an iPAQ (CachingCin?) that had the cache description pages on it. Do GPSrs do this?) What is workse is that I am headed to Spokane on Friday (returning on Monday or Tuesday) and I would like to do some caching on the trip. Now I dropped by REI the other day to see what the fuss was about this new 60cs (or whatever it is called), but the clerk wasn't very helpful. I suspect that a major part of the problem is that I don't know much about what these units do, or how they really work. I've sort-of seen a couple of people using a "real" GPSr, but I didn't really understand what they were showing me. (This reminds me of the first time I saw a MAcintosh running MacOS 7. The fundamentals of interacting with the Mac were so different from those of Windows 3.1 that there wasn't much of a comparison -- other than that they both used monitors.) Thus don't have a good feel for what makes a good unit. (Other than the price.) I've heard that some folks have bought one GPSr only to upgrade later to a better model. I'm wondering if such a person would be willing to lend me an older model for this trip, and also to briefly tutor me on how it is used. (I'm used to using paper for everything.) Wow. What a lame post!

So, I just got my photos of the hike off of my camera and now I am curious about something. Is it better to post them here, or to attach it to my log? Opinions?

What a choice day to be born! It was beautiful out. Congratulations to you all!

Runhills, As of now, I have no idea! No one has attempted to "claim" a seat. MarcusArelius seemed interested, but I don't know if that is 1 or 2 seats. Seth and Adrian and ?? may be coming, but no word from them if they need/want a ride. Pepper wrote that she would be coming, but again no word. TotemLake - no word. Basically at this point I don't know if I am driving or if I will try to get a ride with someone else. I guess it depends on who shows up. Great planning, eh?

OK. I just put one of the two other seats into my van. This means it will seat 6 adults (driver + 5). That also makes it much easier for adults to get into and out of the rear seat, and leaves room for a dog or two, depending on their size. Runhills, you made a comment about a muddy dog. Somehow I don't think this could be much of a problem. I mean, wait 5 minutes and it won't be mud anymore, will it? As for dirtying up my van, well, I've had kids riding in it for years. I did clean it up quite a bit today, but I didn't have time to clean the carpet. So if it gets dirty it won't be that big of a deal as I intend to clean the carpet anyway. Seth, what do you mean about "shade/no shade"?

Oh, well. I was just thinking about the approximate time to trailhead of 1.5 hours, and that I should get to the P&R at that time so that folks had time to load up before leaving the P&R. I've since seen Jeremy suggesting a meeting time of 6:30 AM. I guess years of trying to get kids together to go somewhere has trained me to expect to take longer to do anything!

Ah! I remember this P&R. Sorry for the confusion. My Nellie. Ooops. Sorry, I meant to say "my bad".

Sorry, I was a bit busy yesterday making some preparations for this outing, and I need to do some more stuff today -- like getting some moleskin! My van is the size that when configured with bench seats would carry 4+3+3+2= 12 people. However it is configured to carry 7. Right now the back seat is in place (which holds 3 people, or 4 small kids), as are the front two captain's chairs -- one for the driver and the other to the driver's right. As I mentioned before I have two additional captain's chairs that can be installed right behind the front two chairs. The area behind the back set isn't all that deep -- maybe a foot or so, but I used to pack suitcases and such back there. I've also put paper boxes (8x11.5 sheets, 10 reams/box) there as well, though I cannot remember if they fit the long way. I thought I would bring along a large ice chest to keep some water and/or pop in, and possibly some food as well. I don't know if people tend to lunch on the trail, or after it is all over. So, the question I have is: how many folks would like to ride in my van? I would like a head count so I know whether or not to put the additional chairs in. Of course, I could put in a single chair, too. The advantage of not putting both chairs in is that it is easier to get into and out of the back seat. In fact, when we got the van one of the chairs was not installed. I suppose in that mode we could carry a dog (or two) in the "open" area. As for the timing, well, it seems to me that we ought to leave the Park & Ride at about 6 AM. Totemlake, I presume the one you mean is where Pepper's cache "SG #31 - Forever Green - TB Exchange too!" is located. I "ran into" Right Wing Wacko there, but I know that would be quite a drive for him to meet us there. (Were he interested in doing so.) This brings up a second issue, which has to do with the additional caches that RWW suggested. If the van riders were agreed I wouldn't mind doing those, but I don't have my heart set on it. Whew! So many questions!

So, um, it sounds to me as though everyone is expecting to meet at the trailhead rather than somewhere in town. Doesn't that mean 5-6 cars driving up there? I understand John's need to bring his own vehicle for the quick get-away, but it doesn't sound like a bright idea for me to bring my full-size van just for a shuttle between end-points of the hike. Worse is that I don't know where either end-point is! I thought it we carpooled to the area I could ride or drive with someone who knew where we were going. Perhaps, though, we are too scattered for starting together anywhere but at the trailhead. So, any idea how long it takes to get to the trailhead from Bothell if you drive the speed limit?

Re: Transportation. I don't know how far away this trip would be, but I have a full-size van that seats 5 -- or 7 if I put the two other Captains chairs back in. Of course, being such a large vehicle it doesn't get the best gas mileage, so if folks would like to share a ride and expense I would be happy to drive. Otherwise perhaps I could get a lift from someone else? Has there been a "standard" meeting place?

Well, I would be interested in this. I heard from Totemlake last year about some group hikes/hunts, but this is the first I heard of such. How do you coordinate everything? One potential problem for me it that it's been years since I've hiked. I may be rather slow.

I've just read through all of the posts in this thread, and think that these coins look great! Also I've noted that the Jeep Travel Bugs appear to have semi-random tracking numbers. Perhaps part of the new database designed makes it easier to track things that way. (Could it be using a hash table?) Anyway, The Jester made a comment early on about having a Rainier plane flying over Mount Boeing. This got me thinkging, especially in light of the concerns about the cost of the coins. You know, if we're going to mark Olympia then perhaps we should ask for a donation from one of these political folks for the "free advertising". Better yet, has anyone considered seeking corporate sponsorship? Yeah, that's it! Put a little "m" over Redmond on the map side of the coin. Maybe Billyco will pick up the entire cost of the coins as a tax deduction. In any case, I'll take 10 -- perhaps more if needed. Pepper, are you keeping a tally of pre-orders?

Wow! This is way cool! OK, so this will be my first post in the forums, as I couldn't seem to get my account to work until today. As Leatherman pointed out I've been using my NextTel i58sr phone to do my geocaching. Someone else commented about the "dead reckoning" issue. With the phone GPS I have to ask the phone to figure out where I am currently, and then I have to determine which way to go to get closer to the cache. A couple of problems show up with this approach. The first problem (which I don't have happen too often) is I may get confused as to which way is North. Sometimes I'll head 90 degrees away from the direction I *think* I am going, and may not realize that the wrong coordinate is changing. (Duh...) I cannot seem to remember to bring my old Boy Scouts of America compass with me on a regular basis, either. A second problem occurs more frequently, and that has to do with reception. Apparently when a "real" GPSr unit is turned on it is in constant contact with the satellites to keep track of its position. My guess is that this "constant lock" help when you get into tree cover. With the cell phone, well, it seems to search for any satellites every time I ask "where am I?" This is especially true if I haven't asked for several minutes, but under tree cover it can get *really* bad. In cases like these I'll look for a clearing South or North of the cache to determine the position of the West coordinate, and East/West to determine the position of the North coordinate, and draw an intersection of those in my mind. Sometimes this works really well, and other times it doesn't. Probably the worst problem I have with the phone is poor short-term memory. [] See, the cell phone doesn't have the ability to store any data about a cache. As a result I used to always bring a printed cache data sheet with me so that I would be able to refer to it for the correct coordinates, have a place to write down the coordinates of the next waypoint (or something similar), or (if I needed it) to be able to translate the hint. As I got better at finding caches I stopped bringing the data sheets with me, and this problem started to occur more frequently. In fact over this last weekend I spent a good 30 minutes searching for a cache .010 minutes North of the cache because I didn't remember to coordinates correctly. Now the phone I have also is web-enabled, but it is really difficult to use. I find I cannot navigate the geocaching.com web site at all with it, so I was quite pleased to see these two URLs posted. I'll have to try them -- but quickly! Why, you ask? Because I may not have this cell phone much longer. It is company issue, and I've just had yet another freedom from work day. []