Pto
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Posts posted by Pto
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My answer to the topic? You wont. Why?
If I can't find it but know I'll be back within a week or so, I don't mark it DNF.
But you didn't find it, so why not log it that way? If you go back another day and find it make a new log that says you did.
Here is an example of 2 differing logics opposed to each other. I agree with the first. You wont pursuade me into doing something simply because you have an alternate viewpoint. I'll be back to try again. If after several tries, depending on quality- Ill post it- but for no reason other than, I want to.
One would think that cachers with thousands of finds and tons of ‘experience’ would lead by example but that is not always the case.
Hello there. I'm one of those cachers in your local area with "thousands of finds and tons of 'experience'." In fact, there's nobody in Southwest PA with more logged finds.
Please see the link in my forum signature line, below: "I log *all* my DNF's." Follow the link to my bookmark list, where I meticulously keep track of each and every one of them. DNF logs are fun to read.
I have tried my best to lead by example in this subject area for years.
I appluad your efforts to keep things going in the direction you prefer. Its certainly a time investment Im guessing not everyone can make work into thier lives. Congrats on doing so, but I believe thinking that will be the norm is unreasonable.
It mystifies me* that all of these threads on how to increase cachers' willingness to log a DNF start out by ascribing negative qualities to those who don't DNF to the poster's standard. They're afraid. They're ashamed. They lack common sense. In addition to being beside the point, these sorts of statements undercut the stated purpose, which is to persuade people to log their attempts to find a cache, successful or not.
We could just as easily ascribe their non-DNFs to positive qualities: They're optimistic (I'll get it next time). They're determined (I'm not giving up!). They're modest (Cache is fine; I'm just blind!).
Fact is that encouraging DNF logging is an uphill battle. There's no individual incentive for writing a DNF log; virtually all benefits go to the cache owner and subsequent seekers. All the DNF writer gets is an ugly blue frownie that looks like the new-age symbol for poison:
The burden lies with you who are dissatisfied with the status quo to persuade cachers to log more DNFs. My suggestion is that you first drop the casual slanders, or adopt (even insincerely) the positive interpretations of their motives in order to catch more with honey rather than vinegar. Then promote the sensible, ground-zero guideline for logging DNF. "Goto" may work for you, but it's a non-starter for most cachers; see the accumulating comments in this and other threads on the subject.
*Not really.
^^ Very well stated and I agree.
Pushing people into something is never as easy as leading them.
Also- on TrailGators point, I agree- If a DNF log is meant to tell the owner or other caches the cache is or might be missing - well that is 100% why I dont post some of my DNF's. When I didnt find it - that has nothing to do with whether or not is missing.
No, no "what ifs" because the sun was in your eyes or your cell phone rang or you didn't spend enough time there. All those excuses are unnecessary for the simple question of whether you found it or not.
Says You. I prefer "to each his own" and dont care much for "Because I said so"
What Ive also seen is an increase, especially in newer cacher in the use of the "Needs maintenance" log on a simple Dnf? 2 finds under their belt- post something like , looked for 5 minutes- didnt find it- Must be gone.
Where do you suppose this is being learned?
Maybe trying to hard to "fit in"? I dont know- but This isnt the first thread Ive seen on this locally or nationally and I dont think it will be the last.
There (have been and)will always be people who truly believe THEY know what the Right way to cache is
and that everyone should play the game their way.
Heres a question for those folks.
If I find a cache online I want to seek in a very cool area, then drive all the way to that area- but choose to use the area for a different recreation, rather than looking for the cache- did I DNF, since I went to the park afterall? I mean, I was within maybe 1000ft of the cache- but went out on the lake canoing instead-
Obviously (to me anyway) Its not a dnf, since I did not look. Even If I had given a 2 minute run thru the area, I would feel the same way. I went canoing, and glanced around an area near a cache. Not the same - again- to Me - as checking every nook in a 30 foot radius, and not logged the same either. Id log an intnese search as a dnf tho- but not as missing, just as I didnt Find it.
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Why am I not surprised that nerdy Zach knows of geocaching.
Yeah, I agree- I caught that too - and then realized I have been sucked into this stupid show by my wife....
(and even like it?
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As if I'm sure you haven't gone on and on and on and on saying the same thing over on the issue. Does "how does it effect you" ring a bell? Hello pot? This is kettle. You're black. And of course I'm sure you didn't notice (before Baloo pointed it out) that the OP was a Wisconsite. Just took the ball and ran with the dead horse pic afer the last post in the thread, eh?
Im black now huh?
I did 2 searches 1 on each of us for "multiple logging" We both had about the same amount of threads returned, but I didnt go thread by thread to compare actualy numbers. Funny how I can be pot/kettled - but you didnt acknowledge the point.
True, however there are new people everyday. A new person may find this practice acceptable, and for some of the very reasons I mentioned along with the fact that it is not a common practice, it appears the majority does not feel it should be.
From my perspective, it is a real issue due to the fact that if it gets too out of hand, GC will decide to put an end to it in the manner such as they did with virtuals. There are some cases where multiples sort of make sense (i.e. re-using event pages each month or year, lazy but done) and, while I would not encourage it on one of our caches, I also do not want the option to totally disappear.
If the thread gets out of hand, the moderators will close it. Discussing it now and then shouldn't really hurt and will let newbies know the how the cachers at large feel about certain practices and they can make decisions accordingly.
Fair enough. We dont need any new guidelines to "handle" this though.
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No, but I'm ecstatic that I have the quoted post that would get someone so worked up that they'd post a dead horse picture on an internet message board. You really need some new schtick there.
Im not worked up in the least bit. People like you actually make me laugh, for going on and on and on and on about something irrelevant. Havent you already posted this same post, or many like it saying the same thing? Do you know what "beating a dead horse means?"
Still going with this?
Guess what - Life has gone on just the same for everyone hasnt it?
Dont you feel better tho for picking on WI again.
I guess I can only speak for myself. If I painted the "WI event issue" with a very wide brush. I apologize.
It does seem to be centralized and, from they way it appears, it is a small group that puts on the events and those that take advantage are not exclusively from behind the cheese curtain.
This small group has given the reputation. You may feel like we're hammerin' you, however they gave us the nails.
While I too believe that there should be one cache=one log, I would prefer to stay self-policing since these appear to be more or less isolated. It would be nice to have it noted in the guidelines however.
(Note: The OP is a Wisconsinite.)
I understand what you mean, and that the OP is from WI... but Yet another topic on this?
Everything here has been said, by mostly the same people - that was my point.
In the old days everyone would just Markwell you back to the older posts, and even not allowed duplicate repeat threads.
This is old news, isnt it>?
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The worst example of this I've seen was last summer. There was an event cache (I won't say where, but it was in a State whose name begins with "W", and is famous for cheese production
) that listed it's 20 or so temporary caches that were going to be available "up front" on the cache listing a week or so before the event happened. At least 6, maybe 8 of these temporary caches were Virtuals! What's up with that? New Virtuals are no longer published on this website, and obviously don't meet the guidelines!!!Still going with this?
Guess what - Life has gone on just the same for everyone hasnt it?
Dont you feel better tho for picking on WI again.
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It would give geocachers in general a Bad Name if others were out hiding caches in places that are
currently off limits. There are reasons for the guidelines in place here, and the caching community has had to fight to be allowed in many places. IMO, its not something you'd want to start.....
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try emailing them directly @ webmaster@mngca.org
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So are they suggesting not to use ammo cans?
Do you see that printed anywhere?
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The less rules the better.
IMO, dont go full blown, non profit or anything like that-In my state, doing that requires you send the state of list of your members first, last names (and addresses I think)
Alot of people dont want to be so formally involved, especially when it involves registering with the state simply to belong to a geocaching org.
Less rules the better!!!
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Send an email to This guy
He should be able to help you- he is an admin on the mngca forum. Not many of them come here too often.
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I did mine thru This site
I believe there are several tho
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I agree with the part of planning. But. lets say you're out for a weekend of caching and you have your PDA and GPS and thats all. You didnt want to spend alot of computer time getting ready for this. I was just wondering how difficult it would be for the Powers That Be to add a place for the distance. In fact the person that hid this cache could measure it as they are leaving it. Of course if its close then its of no concern. It would also help if these distances could be part of a PQ.
I have caches in a park near my home, which I walked to when placing. They are in a large park, and can be accessed from many different parking lots, depending on personal choice. If they plan on doing more than 1 in the park, they can park on one end, in the middle, etc- As a hider, I have no way of knowing which direction people will choose to approach from, if they will walk, ride a bike(near a bike trail) or drive.
I have a cache named after a Waterfall located in a large City park. It has a big sign, history, etc-
I see a lot of logs from cachers who dont even see the waterfall, because they come in from the other direction, and leave that way. There is parking at the waterfall, but . . . . . .
I use the addt'l waypoint called parking when I find it useful, or needed (2 of my other caches.) so I understand why you would like to see this.
On the other hand, it would make hides like mine pretty hard to accurately post the distance- then people would be upset at walking further, by parking somewhere else - even tho the info would then be on the cache page (some people dont think reading the page is required, etc)
the additional waypoint feature works well for this now so I wouldnt see a real need to make it required.
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. . .you get the benifits of posting it found but you keep your count accurate in the long run.
Why is anyone concerned about My find count? And who to say whether its "accurate" or not?
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Makes perfect sense to me-
which is why some people will have a problem with it.
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I played in the woods, and was exposed to it a ton when I was younger, then didn’t see it much for a few years. In my early teens, it didn’t affect me. After 30, if I was exposed, Id get the: symptoms, slight itch after a few days, but only for an hour or so.
FOr me, the "rash" is only as bad as you make it. If you are an Itcher, that can/will make your life miserable. I learned from skeeter bites, before I was 8 that scratching doesn’t help
Like I’ve heard said of pain: Pain is relative.
Well, for me, PI is relative. I could walk thru an acre of it alone, go home shower and be fine.
If I am with someone who runs around eagle eyes on the ground, pointing out every PI leaf I touch
and going on and on about how bad it is, I should stay away, shower, etc- then I follow the same routine, but the seed is planted in my head- and I end up thinking about it, and getting the :'s, slight itches.
When that happens, how long it lasts usually related to how badly I was brainwashed by whoever was with me
(And how much I scratch it) I do get some minor symptoms, but seem to be able to control it, somewhat. Honestly, since It never affected me, I have never really learned to identify it -(more so acknowledge seeing it when I see it) so am oblivious when I come in contact or from where.
If it isn’t pointed out, I am naware I have been exposed-(In my minds eye anyway)
So no reaction.
As I get older I also learned to dress the role for going adventuring in the woods (as I did when I was a kid)
Long pants, socks and shoes/mid to high boots/long sleeves if possible, and of course a baseball hat.
Keep your hands up as you walk thru anything. Less than that is "risking" exposure.
Brainwashed . . . that’s the ticket. Same as pain. Pain is relative. Exposure is also relative for me.
Heat rash is a whole 'nother story (and no not from wearing to many cloths in the woods in 100 degree heat)
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Adblock = no adds
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As of now, I now longer think derailing a thread is not funny. It is.
I also have switched sides on the moderation thing- I no longer dont not like it.
I do tend to play devils advocate in some discussions while I dont always hold a certain view or side with that view. To the poster, its a point/counter point kind of thing, not so much "well I feel this way" Ive been pursuaded to change my mind on some things, but as was said- its always these forum discussions and not on my basic principles.
also to add- BAD crc BAD (in my best Im mad at my cat voice, stomping my foot) !
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Yes, and without further details I cant tell If your worried because you had to cross a wet log in a stream, and thought that was " obviosly dangerous" or found a live pwerline at ground zero....???
Walking in the woods on a trail can be "dangerous" all by itself-
I think and SBA is a bit extreme unless it violates guidelines, or is otherwise out of line.....
Just my .02
More info?
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If you have to log in to see coords, why not make the adds shown only to people who are visiting?
I have been around a while, but never dropped my $30- Im a bad bad person. But, I am a long time user and already seeing adds all over the place elsewhere, in my cache listings etc. Give and take? Count the hits on my cache pages, and I get a free week of add free? There are lots of ways to work this...
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To me that says go ahead and place them. I'm still waiting to be sure / safe though.[/font]
How will you achieve the goal of the contest if you drop the jeep before it starts (And you learn what the task will be) ?
I'd say wait if you plan to enter the contest- but if not- then drop it
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Good Idea. If the person receiving is paying for shipping. I am not.
I still havent gotten mine, but if I do and its an Alabama - I'll surely send it along your way.
Even if I have to pay that whopping 1.20 to mail it. . .
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If you'd remove it, why would you remove it? As I've said this isn't the only site dedicated to the game of geocaching, and just because a cache might not be approved here doesn't mean it wouldn't be approved elsewhere
Sally
so get it approved elsewhere. why should you care which listing service you use?
So, would you remove it? That was the part I saw as the real question here.
There is no competition for cache listing in my area, so Ive never run into this problem-
Me, no I wouldnt remove it - Id sign it and probably log it, if I was already "on" the site the hider was. If it was blatantly "bad' for the game, Id probably pull it, and email the hider to decrease the bad press from that happening. Otherwise a note to the hider, leaving it in place expressing my concerns.
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Well, according to googlemaps, the whole Area51 area is just an irregularly shaped gray blob.
37.239, -115.816
Nice baseball field they have just to the west of those coords. . . .
I did 2 searches 1 on each of us for "multiple logging" 
Geocaching has changed
in General geocaching topics
Posted
Well in MN< the quality level has decreased, and the micro's on a pole have increased- and the MN approvers just keep approving them??
One series is a transit-way- micros stuck to poles along a transit route. Yippee.
Another series is (Get this) Dead End Streets!! All micros stuck in signs on dead end streets. Wow, and its a whole series!
Another few caches are hidden on empty lots in what I consider a shady part of town I wouldnt visit for fear of being attacked.
The location does not seem to matter to many these days. Its all about the numbers.
Just last week was my 11th year since joining, and I have a whopping 86 finds (logged here) I do it for the fun of it, getting out in the woods but finding a micro on a pole in a parking lot isnt fun regardless of what I call it. Geocaching isnt about finding a no parking sign, or at least thats not what I got into it for.
Those people can have thier "fun" and I will have mine- we just wont cross paths very often if ever.
I just got back from replacing my 8 year old ammo can cache down in the woods along the Mississippi. 1st time its gone missing in all that time. Only 15 DNF's - 259 smileys.
Mine is 1 of a series of 50, so the cachers are often the more dedicated cachers - Traveling the entire country hitting every state-
They take "Cache Across America" very seriously!
Just two kinds of people playing the same "game", but playing 2 completely different "games" in reality