SeattleWayne

If it turns out to be a location where the cache ends up being muggled a lot or cachers aren't kind to it, and you're constantly having to make maintenance checks, it might become more trouble than it's worth.

Find your true self, and go from there.

Yes, exactly.

And I have to point out again, to those who balk at the idea that for them geocaching should be a free ride or nothing - every single cacher who placed a cache for your finding pleasure invested time, effort and money to do so. If you think that's not worth a few dollars a year on your part, I certainly won't lose any sleep over your choice that geocaching isn't for you. Not to mention a large building to make it all happen near downtown Seattle where renting or leasing said building can be very, very expensive. Seems funny this keeps being brought up. This thread wasn't started by someone wanting to freeload. Are you sure? No hides recorded... Decides to quit as soon as it looks like cost will be incurred... Nope.. But since the OP specifically mentioned it, his statement came across to me as suggesting he had purchased the apps times 4. If this is the case, then those paid for apps showed all caches except PM. GS took the paid app away and gave us the new and improved free version. Only thing is, the new app took caches away that anyone (premium or basic) with the paid app could normally see. I've always supported GS with premium membership. It's helped them and at the same time, benefited me with the nice add on features. The business decision to make a free app but then take away a primary function that has always been in place is what's causing the angst,, imo. So the old paid for app could allow people to find PM caches without being a PM? Who buys the app four times...Lol Maybe a family, where they install it on each phone? It was stated in the very top post. Lol. As this thread has trended towards judging the OP, did anyone bother to notice their join date? Joined:23-September 12 Not exactly a new player. Regardless of number of finds or hides, their opinion should be respected. They did try to play the game and eventually found it wasn't to their liking. Considering the loss of players affects the metrics discussed in another thread, are these moves good ones, is the question. There will certainly be thousands more who don't post here and we can only guess what makes them come and go, but I will leave this discussion with this thought: I've met a fair number of people I've tried to introduce the game to and many already had - they weren't liking it and gave up on it. How do you grow the game without new players? How do you stop shedding existing players? It was stated in the very top post why they decided to leave the game, and it wasn't because they didn't like it anymore. Just so you know. The underlying message I got from all of this from the OP was: they had to purchase memberships to continue playing on the level they were accustomed to (also stated in the top post). Yet, they purchased an app four times, and four memberships. If spending money on Geocaching was such a drag, why spend so much? Why not look at an alternative. Make one family account for everyone to use. That's one membership not four. No one is "judging" anyone here. The game isn't free.

And I have to point out again, to those who balk at the idea that for them geocaching should be a free ride or nothing - every single cacher who placed a cache for your finding pleasure invested time, effort and money to do so. If you think that's not worth a few dollars a year on your part, I certainly won't lose any sleep over your choice that geocaching isn't for you. Not to mention a large building to make it all happen near downtown Seattle where renting or leasing said building can be very, very expensive. Seems funny this keeps being brought up. This thread wasn't started by someone wanting to freeload. Are you sure? No hides recorded... Decides to quit as soon as it looks like cost will be incurred... Nope.. But since the OP specifically mentioned it, his statement came across to me as suggesting he had purchased the apps times 4. If this is the case, then those paid for apps showed all caches except PM. GS took the paid app away and gave us the new and improved free version. Only thing is, the new app took caches away that anyone (premium or basic) with the paid app could normally see. I've always supported GS with premium membership. It's helped them and at the same time, benefited me with the nice add on features. The business decision to make a free app but then take away a primary function that has always been in place is what's causing the angst,, imo. So the old paid for app could allow people to find PM caches without being a PM? Who buys the app four times...Lol

Your cache, "Wrong side of the tracks," is properly awaiting review. It is common for reviewers to publish caches without issues quickly, while saving the ones needing further study for later on. I expect that the delay is due to the need to study the nature of the railroad line where your cache is hidden. Typically when a railroad line is formally "abandoned" (a legal process), the track markings disappear from Google maps. There is a difference between "nobody seems to be using these train tracks anymore" and "the railroad has given up ownership of their right-of-way." Until ownership is relinquished, the trespassing concern remains. If you have additional information about the formal abandonment process, I'd encourage you to post that to your cache listing as a new reviewer note. Keystone is GOAT.

And I have to point out again, to those who balk at the idea that for them geocaching should be a free ride or nothing - every single cacher who placed a cache for your finding pleasure invested time, effort and money to do so. If you think that's not worth a few dollars a year on your part, I certainly won't lose any sleep over your choice that geocaching isn't for you. Not to mention a large building to make it all happen near downtown Seattle where renting or leasing said building can be very, very expensive. Seems funny this keeps being brought up. This thread wasn't started by someone wanting to freeload. Right. It's about "principle".

Nice. It looks like a tiffin box (lunch boxes used in India). Metal, sturdy latch. Very nice. My one concern is I don't see a gasket. Have you tried putting it under water? If it's watertight, that's an impressive container. Can you imagine hiding 200 of these? It's a stainless steel cooking pot from the local camping store, which I then painted grey to comply with the national parks service requirements. There's no gasket so it's not completely waterproof, but my hiding place is deep inside a wind-eroded alcove just below the edge of a ridge so it's unlikely to get wet and as a precaution against condensation I'm using an all-weather "Tradie" notebook with waterproof paper made from pulverised stone as the logbook. Nice container. Muggles may not get to it but that one dishonest Finder who decides on keeping this puppy for themselves...well, that's a whole different story. Two hours from the trailhead...sheesh! No thanks!

As for cache theft, locally we don't have much of a problem. But we do have a Muggle problem at one park where someone was placing nasty stuff in the container, so that cache got archived. One problem that we do have is some kid that goes around and picks up TB's and keeps them. Right now there are 17 TB's in their account and growing. Has anyone emailed him and explained how TBs work?

And I have to point out again, to those who balk at the idea that for them geocaching should be a free ride or nothing - every single cacher who placed a cache for your finding pleasure invested time, effort and money to do so. If you think that's not worth a few dollars a year on your part, I certainly won't lose any sleep over your choice that geocaching isn't for you. Not to mention a large building to make it all happen near downtown Seattle where renting or leasing said building can be very, very expensive.

You ought to call the non-emergency line to local authorities to express your concern next time. 911 is for emergencies only.

Huh? Bookmarks (https://www.geocaching.com/account/lists) and pocket queries (https://www.geocaching.com/pocket/default.aspx) are still there, and are listed on the dashboard. Both of which are available to premium members but not to basic, which is why PP apparently returned to premium membership to get them back. That's what I meant. Not being a PM meant the loss of the bookmarks and pq's, and was the ultimate reason why we paid up finally. Caching without them is a ridiculously painful and frustrating experience. The search function as a Basic Member is abysmal. Maybe when we get some sort of mobile phone (soon), we might search out the various free non-GS apps. What I've read here on the forums about the GS app is not encouraging. Free should not equal useless, and we might very well be Basic Members again soon. B. This is what i was kinda getting at. We can say that geocaching is still free but Groundspeak has made sure to take things away that i thought would always be there. It's definitely a tougher hobby to pursue if you don't pony up. OP bought four apps (1 per phone) and four memberships for each family member. If OP truly was concerned about the money aspect, OP could have easily made one family account, and used one phone. OP says it's not about the money, but about principle. $120 in memberships a year plus $40 in app purchases... Why OP thinks he needed to pay all of that $$ is beyond me.

The membership is roughly $2.50 a month. If you really wanted to cut cost, you can make a "family" account so you're only paying for one membership, and use one phone with the app. That way you're not paying for four apps and four memberships. No one is forcing anyone to purchase anything. Hope you had fun, at least.

It surprised me a little too, not so much North America but the European countries that were known for a lot of geocaching activity (Germany, Czech Republic), are also in decline. At this time of the year (warmer weather) one expects a jump in active cachers. It will be interesting to see what the stats are like during the summer months in 2017. Maybe cache quality is having a negative effect. Maybe app users are less inclined to commit to the pastime. Pre-app days, GPS owners made more of an investment in the game. A survey of people who have declined their geocaching activity and why they decreased participation, would be interesting. I've been decreasing my activity in the past 3 years by 100 less each year. 2 finds so far this year. I've got a laundry list of reasons, but most people here are quite aware of my gripes. I believe we have similar reasons for slowing down. For me, the two things you mentioned (quality and the app) have definitely had an impact on the slow down. Groundspeak itself hurt the hobby when they did the power trail flip flop a few years ago. Then afterwards, pushed the app out as just another game for people to play. I have no doubt that most people coming into the hobby via the app never really look into or see what geocaching can be. As far as the Project-GC stats are concerned, because of what i see around our area, the numbers don't surprise me. What can it be?

Aren't reviewers volunteers? CathyH probably has lots of caches to review and publish on top of the 36 you want published.

I'm not entirely sure what happens to a persons account after prolonged inactivity. But as others have stated, make sure you're logging Needs Maintenance logs, DNFs, and Needs Archived so reviewers can open up those areas for fresh caches.

Is that a skill? No. It's a way of life. You don't choose to Geocache. Geocaching chooses you. Putting that thought provoking commment to one side... My linkhttp://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=311306&view=findpost&p=5653652 Should we be concerned for your geocaching skills? That happened one time. And I was irked. Hence the need for abandoned, or un-maintained caches to be removed. It's been mentioned before. Just because a cacher can't find a cache, even after several attempts, doesn't mean the cache isn't there or isn't maintained. Just because a cache seeker contacts a CO and asks for a hint, but gets no response, doesn't mean the CO has abandoned the cache. <eom> We're in no way talking about asking for hints, and not receiving them. Maybe read the actual conversation before chiming in with an accusatory, and irrelevant 'suggestion'. Thanks. Excuse you?! Maybe you should read the actual comments quoted in a post before chiming in with your condescending comments. Thanks! SeattleWayne said he DNF'd a cache several times and he was irked him that he didn't receive hints. Then you said "hence" it should be removed because it's abandoned/unmaintained. I would also like to add that some people were finding it and some were not. So it was certainly there.

Maybe two different types of caches?

I just started using the new dash boards and profiles today. Seems pretty cool.

You can create alerts for new caches published in your area, and the alerts will be sent to you via email. Once the email is published, set out to find it, and maybe you'll be the FTF.

There was a cache, explained in the cache description that the cache was on the porch. It was a little bird house with a small door with origami inside. There's another cache on someone's porch in my area but I don't think I'll be going for it anytime soon.

My wife is the one who logs the caches we find. We own a few in our area and check on them as often as possible. I can hardly find the enthousiasm to log my own finds, but my wife has logged 439 finds and 6 hides, most of which I participated in. We do try to clean up and restore caches if necessary. Saw some while camping last Summer and one in particular was placed by a Forces member who'd been moved away, but nobody wanted to adopt it. We changed the container and log book, and added some decent swag. The number of times I've reported caches in need of maintenance and never heard back is also annoying. But it gets tedious to always find the caches in similar condition. If you find a cache, and are sure the Co moved away hence no longer able to take care of their cache, why aren't you posting a NA log? Wayne - I agree. But in a few of these threads (they're all running together for me now) posting that would get you flamed for "blasphemy." Something should be done to clean up abandoned caches... People shouldn't get mad at anyone for suggesting their cache needs to be archived after months and months of inactivity. Especially if they've moved away. If a cache has been disabled for several months without any Co updates, a note asking for an update followed by a NM log shouldn't be frowned upon.

My wife is the one who logs the caches we find. We own a few in our area and check on them as often as possible. I can hardly find the enthousiasm to log my own finds, but my wife has logged 439 finds and 6 hides, most of which I participated in. We do try to clean up and restore caches if necessary. Saw some while camping last Summer and one in particular was placed by a Forces member who'd been moved away, but nobody wanted to adopt it. We changed the container and log book, and added some decent swag. The number of times I've reported caches in need of maintenance and never heard back is also annoying. But it gets tedious to always find the caches in similar condition. If you find a cache, and are sure the Co moved away hence no longer able to take care of their cache, why aren't you posting a NA log?

Geocaching will certainly survive.

If a cacher sees that a cache has been inactive for a long period of time, what's stopping someone from posting a NM or a NA log? Maybe it's an extra step in your day but at the very least you're getting the inactive caches some much needed attention and if the CO decides he/she doesn't want to do anything with the cache then it gets archived.