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Everything posted by gallet

  1. Hmmmmmm guess I must be using my 60Csx wrong then because I use it ONE HANDED ALL THE TIME! OK, no need to shout. I'm sure about 50% of people use it one handed. I'm not saying it can't be used, I'm saying it's non ergonomic. Non ergonomic. Look at a screenshot of the video that is linked to in the recent post... Notice how the pinky is not involved. To hold the 60 in that manner requires the pinky to be arched so it doesn't support the 60. The middle finger is a pivot point, as it is well below centre the unit is not balanced in the hand requiring lots of subtle movements that cause carpal tunnel syndrome. Still usable though. The index finder not doing anything except to stop the top heavy top falling backward. But in the film all he is doing is moving the top buttons. Not using the rocker at all. See the arrow, that's pointing to the 'enter' button, notice that it is about 1/3" from the bottom of the unit. Try and imagine if you will the position of his hand when he puts the tip of his thumb on the 'enter' button. It would be easier if the thumb had an extra phalanx but that's thumbs for you. Now imagine the thumb pressing the rocker, not just pressing it but having to exert a sideways force in all directions, and after ever movement having to press the awkward 'enter' button. This is what you have to do if you enter data. Of course it's usable, but it is not ergonomic. It's ok that you like the HCX better - no one really cares. Likewise no once cares I like the 60csx. But please quite spreading misinformation (which is really YOUR OPINION). Hey you can shout about it being my opinion, and I do have my opinions but you still need to tell me which thing I've said that are facts that you think are opinions. Regarding the bit that you quoted before shouting about my opinion... your thumb has to scroll then come off the rocker, move to the 'enter' button, then return to the rocker for the next letter and so on. The above is a factual statement. It is so obviously factual that I really cannot understand how you can refer to it as an opinion. But there you go.
  2. weird, I tried it in FF and Safari, both of which have never given me any problem with YT. D, link is good, but I'm crashing now. You can pm me the link. This is not a bad idea actually. It would be good to have a similar video of each doing the same typical operations. Would be a lot more useful than all the argy bargy.
  3. er what were these opinions I presented as facts? If you can't answer then I'll answer for you. None.
  4. Gee whiz, Fanboy, fanboy, fanboy, now it's "Troll". Then you malign my reasoning because I don't play the cache game. Don't you think that is a bit sad? And don't you think it's a bit funny that you say "without actually debating with FACTS", when I've asked you twice what are the "facts" I've referred to which are actually "opinion" I'm sure you've looked but you can't find them so you call me a troll. Pathetic but funny nevertheless.
  5. Not calling you a liar, I'm again calling you illogical. You seem to be unable to comprehend the fallacy of your argument. No...it's not. So why do you keep pretending that it is? If a cache is not a benchmark then ground zero is not a point is it. Ground zero is the error margin of the gps of the person who placed the cache. A setter can be out by 10' west and you can be out by 10' east and you will drop on the cache. That doesn't mean you gps is accurate to 1'. Alternatively with the same 10' accuracy of both units you could just as easily be 20' out as 0'. You said that no GPS can bring you to ground zero. I said they can and do. Let me refresh your memory... It's pretty obvious that you will drop onto a cache exactly purely by chance as it is that you will drop 5' or 10' from it. Are you telling me that if two people go out with a 60CSx each they will both drop to the same spot? They might every now and again.
  6. Pretty much anything you have said before this post. You state (or imply) it as fact when it is not. Is that so. I'm happy to let the reader decide if the Rocker button is concave or it's just opinion. I think this conversation is effectively over. As I said...fanboy. Is that how you respond to a question you can't answer? What have I called a "fact" that is an "opinion" Answer my question from earlier...I have gotten sub-5 foot readings at ground zero from caches I have planted and went back for to test the accuracy. Are you going to call me a liar when i say that they can be that accurate? With respect, it's a stupid question because as far as you know the cache could have been set with an HCx. A cache is not a benchmark. I won't call you a liar, but I will call you illogical.
  7. Can you point me to what I've called a "fact" that you think is an opinion? So I can test the validity of your statement?
  8. @Arthur & Trillian I'm not here to make friends, I'm here to give my opinion so that it's on record when people search google for opinions. Personally I'd rather deal in facts and let the user decide. For example simply describe the action of the rocker button and let a user make up their mind. Look at the rocker in detail and you will see it doesn't sound great, and the fact that people accept it as it is, does not mean it's been made well. As a prospective buyer I'd want to know it has no tactile feedback. The rocker is spongy, when it triggers there is no way to tell by feel, you have to look at the screen. There is still more travel even after it has engaged, if you don't press it hard enough then it won't register. These are all facts that you cannot disagree with. So seeing as you can't feel the minimum pressure needed to trigger it, you inevitably have to use more pressure than is needed. I suppose one just gets used to using more pressure than normal eventually. I only pick one up occasionally and so I never get used to no feedback. We can look more at the factual mechanical operation of the rocker. It has a concave surface, now this is very puzzling because it pivots in the centre so it must be pressed down on the edges, but your thumb naturally sits in the concave centre. Nothing to argue about there is there. Now when using the 60 your thumb must exert a sideways force. This small sideways movement of the thumb to press down on a button is not efficient, it's simple physics. Now these are all facts. It may also be a 'fact' that a lot of people who own one think it's fine. That's also good. But the reader of this post may give a bit more thought to it and check it for himself. These things are not really obvious in a shop. They are not discovered until it's used for a while. If the 76 rocker was on the 60, it would be an improvment. Not by much though. calling me a fanboy is a bit rich, as I said earlier that the gum they use to stick the band on is a disgrace. Which proves that I'm happy to call a spade a spade. "By what working proof do you come to your conclusions? On paper is just that...on paper. Real-world usage is the best determining factor." You did not answer my question, which particular conclusion do you mean? My conclusions are based on real world use.
  9. A&T, which particular conclusion are you referring to. I am unable to understand your reference to my found cache numbers.
  10. Reef Mapper, no one is saying that the 60 is unusable, I'm saying the buttons and placement are not ergonomic. And they aren't. It's a fact. You may like the 60, the buttons may work to your satisfaction, you may have no problems at all with it. But that doesn't change the fact that it is not ergonomic. Just like there is a general impression that the 76 does not have the quad helix because there's no obvious antenna, there is also a general impression that the 60 actually "performs" better than an HCx, meaning it gets better signal, which is not true. Fortunately the 60CSx is now dead. The Colorado has replaced it. It's big like the 60 (not as big) but it has a screen to match so that's OK it's not just big for no reason. Before the H series there was a choice of SirfstarIII or crap reception. A decent choice. But with the H series the main advantage of the 60 was gone in a stroke. But it's back again now with two properly differentiated models, the HCx and the Colorado. Both excellent in their own way.
  11. I don't know about you, but when I pick up my 60 CSx, my thumb sits right above the word Garmin at the bottom of the screen, my "pinky finger" sits just at the bottom of the unit, and my "pointer finger" rest below the knob on the back of the unit. From there I can move my thumb to reach any of the buttons I need. The unit is secure and I don't have to keep a death grip on it to use it. I'm tempted to use a version of the Groucho Marx classic, "who are you going to believe, me or your own eyes"? I'm going to have to see a photo of this, preferably a shot of the natural position where you thumb is under the word garmin etc, then a second photo of your thumb moving from this 'natural postion, to the 'enter button'. Without these two photos I cannot believe you I have to believe my own eyes. In fact, one thing I really like about it is I can put it on a longer cord around my neck and just let it hang--it still gets a good signal. The HCx units really need more "face up" holding just like the Legends did because of the way their antennae are made--or at least the few folks I cache with who use the HCx units keep griping about losing their signals if they don't hold them just right. This is simply not true, the aerial thing is an utter furphy, I've tested them both side by side walking through the bush and I detected no difference holding the HCx upside down around my neck. Which is exactly what I would expect when the HCx can pick up a good signal in side my lounge room with windows far away and only a tiny skylight. But you have it in a nutshell though, the 60CSx *looks better*, 'better' in the sense it looks more manly and macho and a bit like a transceiver, the way it looks it's just gotta be better, if it has a different chip then it must be better. It's a perception that is based on emotion and bad logic. By the way if you let your HCx hang around your neck, as I do, you will appreciate the difference in weight. You can see where the buttons are on the 60 style to push them You *need* to see the buttons on the 60 but, the whole point of putting the eTrex buttons where they are is that you cannot help but let your fingers naturally fall on them and you do not need to look at them to press the correct buttons, as you do on the 60. As for road safety---frankly anything that distracts you from just driving is a hazard. That would be true of the Vista as well as any other unit. When we are out caching, the only time we usually push any button once the unit is in the mount is to say "go to" the next cache. The only other reason I can think of would perhaps to page forward on the directions--naturally one would only do that while stopped so you can read it if you are traveling solo. That's a weak argument on your part anyway--all of those things would just be worse on a Vista. You need to understand the antecedents for this argument. It all starts when someone tries to justify the button layout by saying that you can't get to the buttons of the eTrex in a cradle but the buttons on the 60 are on the front. But as you have finally admitted, we rarely need to press buttons while driving. Personally if using it to navigate while driving I'd have it around my neck or on my lap or on the console and I'd pick it up so I can hold it in front of me and see the road at the same time if I need to. What I'm saying is this, it's fine to prefer the button layout on the 60CSx but it's not right to try and justify the button layout by saying it's better for driving because in the real world it's not an issue as you have said. As for your insistence there are no problems and issues... You know I never said that. In fact I agreed that the gum they use to mount the rubber is a 'disgrace'. Especially as there are excellent alternatives which I've used. But it's not a widespread problem. I think you'll find just as many threads on the 60CSx as the HCx regards to problems. A lot of the HCx threads were about the same anal discussion of the low speed measurement. It's important to some, it's irrelevant to most. Hey if it's really important to someone that they can tell that they are moving at 1mph then sure, get the 60. You links prove nothing, take the first one, so a newbie comes on to the board to say his '99 magellan is da man, and that his geology professor, or whatever said the rocks were the problem, he also does not come back to follow up when someone asks about the map tile boundaries, meanwhile experience users come on and wonder what the problem is. Most issues are like this, millions of newbie threads about imaginary problems. Does it occur to you that dozens of people chime in to say "60 CSX" any time the question comes up and only a handful of people offer "Vista HCx"? There may be a reason for that. Hey does it occur to your that seeing as it was out a year and a half before the HCx it's got a lot more owners, with an emotional attachment I may ad. Most of those who "chime in" are just pushing their own agenda with fake facts, as you have done by trying to pretend the button layout is better for driving while admitting that there's not need to button press while driving. I mean you set it and go.
  12. Maybe you had a really bad one, because I've had mine around my neck on my motorbike in misting rain, no problem. But It's almost unbelievable that Garmin still use this gummy glue, I don't understand it at all.
  13. Yes, I can see your point in the bike example. What sort of stuff do you change while riding? Just curious. Fully agree about the band, it really is a disgrace. Not sure about the not getting it wet bit, but certainly don't leave it in a hot car, but then would you put your gps in the oven? There are plenty of tragic stories of young children who died in a closed car in a very short time. I've had heaps of used etrex and new ones and didn't have any problem till I lent it to a friend and he gave it the oven treatment.
  14. Yes the compass is off. Also, when you get within say 20-25 feet of the cache coords, it does not seem to be able to hold the arrow steady and let you zero in on the cache. It starts to bounce back and forwards and really can't resolve down to give you ground zero. The 60CSx on the other hand holds a steady arrow and drops you down right on top of the cache. Sorry, to say it but you are lying. There is no way your 60CSx will drop you on ground zero. There is no consumer hand held anywhere on earth that will do that. And even if you had a magic 60CSx then you'd need to rely on the cache setter to also have a magical gpsr. In fact you should have you gps in your pocket when you are 20 feet from a cache.
  15. I'd hold off on purchasing an HCx right now That's just silly advice. What are they going to do buy an inferior unit because it doesn't tell you that you are moving at 1mph even if it's useless knowledge? personally think it's the best unit currently on the market The 60CSx and 10m contours are useless except at the highest magnifications due to the absloutely crap resolution. Unlike the Colorado which can not only display 10m contours in 3D mode with smooth useful resoution, but it can render CN better than a dedicated car unit. How can you seriously call the 60 the best unit on the market. he Vista HCx (when they are working correctly) are very close in accuracy to the 60, but in my expereince, the 60 is slightly better. Most people who venture a guess as to why that may be so cite the difference in the atennaes. I'll buy that. "the vista (when they are working correctly" is a sneaky implication that they rarely work. Why speak this garbage? I vastly prefer the button lay-out on the 60 body style to the older "eTrex" style of the Vista. I can leave the 60CSx in a car mount and tap the button to get to any control I want. I can do anything on the trail to my 60CSx with one hand--and do, since I carry a trekking pole in the other hand. I don't believe you. If there's one thing that everyone (else) agrees on it's that the 60 is not a unit designed to be operated with one hand. Think about it, when you hold a 60 in your hand where does your thumb (the finger mostly used) naturally go. Yep it sits way up near the top of the unit on the right (or left). Hey where are the buttons on the 60, they are way down the bottom. funnily enough the buttons on the HCx are exactly where you want them when you hold the unit securely. I'm particularly curious about your car use of the 60. I'm struggling to imagine what buttons you 'tap', actually 'tap' is not a very good word because that's what you do to a touch screen. You don't 'tap' a 60 button, you press it. Firmly. OK so you're driving along and you need to press a button, which button do you press while driving? The only conceivable button is the tiny 4mm hard to press domed buttons that zoom in and out. And if you are leaning over to press that tiny domed button while driving, then you are a seriously dangerous driver and will likely be responsible for a serious accident. Be truthful you don't reach over an tap any buttons on a 60, if you claim you do then please explain the process and what you are doing. Let's talk about the 'one handed' use of the 60 rocker switch with a separate 'enter' domed button immediately below and to it's right. Now when you are on the move and entering a lot of info like an address or simply typing stuff in, and you do it with one hand then your thumb has to scroll then come off the rocker, move to the 'enter' button, then return to the rocker for the next letter and so on. All intelligently designed rockers like this will have an enter button in the centre, you know it makes sense. Which is why the Colorado went down that route. Even the 76 rocker is better due to it having at least a bit of tactile feedback so you know when you press a number without looking at the display. Which means instead looking at the keyboard and entering numbers, you need to keep checking the display to know you pressed hard enough. The natural result of having no tactile feedback is that one will unconsciously press harder than is necessary to avoid re-pressing. I used to use a Legend (same body/button layout as the Vista). I had to use two hands to pull up the next cache, to enter watpoints, etc. With so many of the buttons so tiny and one the side, you can't just "push a button"--you have to steady it from the opposite side. Frankly, I used to lov emy little clickstick on the Legend, ut at the end of the day my fingers were sore from using it and pushing those hard little buttons on the side of the unit. I think you just put this paragraph in for comic relief. Do you understand the concept of "equal and opposite reaction"? If you want to hit the 'find' button on the etrex, it is right where you thumb is if it's in your left hand and if it's in your right hand you press it with your middle finger. You don't really have to 'steady it from the opposite side' because you are *already holding it in your hand*. The rubber gasket around the eTrex style bodies has been known to come off At last some factual info. Yes, I'm unhappy with the quality of sticky gunk they use on the rubber band. I redid mine with seam sealer.
  16. I love the Carabiner attatchment, it allows me to hang to Co from my bike and completely isolates it from any vibration. It's a snug fit and requires some firm pressure sliding it on. I noticed after a while that if I tapped the clip on the back of the Co it made a clicking noise, further investigation indicated that it was a little loose, I could move it side to side by about 1/2mm. I'm wondering how sturdy this will be long term. Does anyone have any idea on the construction of the back of the Co. I can't understand how the clip has been embedded in the back of the case.
  17. @'roadrage64 I still give the 60csx the performance advantage. This is just misinformation. 'performance' is a non word unless you indicate which aspect of 'performance' you refer to. The 60 has a performance disadvantage in the following areas: Battery life, screen brightness, weight, size, and ability to not lose a signal. So I'm not sure what aspects of performance you refer to unless you mean... it still has problems tracking at low (walking) speeds. More misinformation. The newbie might be led to believe that you mean at low speeds it has a problem tracking, ie a problem in doing its most important job. But in fact the HCx is at worst equal to the 60 in tracking at low or high speeds. What you mean is that it has trouble calculating low speeds which is not really very important to almost everyone, although it is to some. 60's performance advantage may no longer be noticable. Aside from performance, everything else is more a matter of personal preference. Like others have said, try to get your hands on both and see which you like better. What is this "performance advantage" of which you speak? You indicate it is something else other than the low speed reading.
  18. What a mess. it's gets worse but I can't be bothered to go looking.
  19. On some of my marine maps in automotive mode all the map tile boundaries get the 3D effect too so it looks like a flipping M C Escher drawing with pipes and tubes intertwining and endlessly disappearing into the distance. Gotta admit though that the Co renders the tile boundaries beautifully, it's a shame they obstruct the information.
  20. On my other GPSr's the tile boundaries only show up when zoomed way out but on the Co they are still visible at close magnifications. There is no declutter and even setting to minimum detail does not affect the visibility of the tile boundaries.
  21. I had continual lockups when trying to use parallels, not with the Co but just trying to work with mapsource. @mightywarlock, no need to quote the previous post when replying.
  22. Just play it with a straight bat, it's worth it to them to keep you as a customer to send you a 20c piece of plastic, so you will spend another $10 in the future and tell others to do the same. These people actually *like* sending out replacement shields. Why else would they go to so much trouble to make sure the shields don't fit as well as they should. They don't even cut all the eTrex Colour shields from the same die even though they are the same size. Really the sellers of the IS are idiots selling a great procuct. They have all these documented problems with the fit and what do they do, yep they spend up big big $'s to redo all their already over done packaging. The new packaging looks like some kind of a joke it's the most elaborate box with die cut compartments and sliding sleeves with fold out doors and other boxes within boxes, all for a tiny piece of plastic it makes Apple's award winning boxes look inadequate. This is the first time I've ever seen the old cliché actually be completely true. The packaging would be way more expensive to produce than the product itself.
  23. You cannot reuse an IS because it is rubbery and stretches when removed, but if you strip it off and send it back they will replace it free.
  24. It's going to take me a week to load up my Colorado because I need to fill it to the max but no one knows what this number is. It's over 4000 and probably under 4500. I don't understand that Garmin can give a precise number of max tiles for the eTrex of 2025 but they can't give a number for the Colorado. Why. I've discovered that if I go over the limit on the external card then the colorado will trash my internal loaded maps permanently. But as I don't know what this magic number is and I need to get as much on as I can, and retransferring to the internal memory is at usb 1.1 speeds, so to creep up to the limit and back down by one tile, is going to take a long time. What I'd rather do is fill the internal memory with what I want and then fill the SD card, unfortunately the SD card took 8 hours to load, so building up to the limit will take me some years.
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